Joomla! Discussion Forums

Are there any plans to eventually make readable, keyword-containing SEF URLs a core component in Joomla 1.5, either by incorporating one of the existing options (i.e. OpenSEF / Artio JoomSEF) or by including a new component to accomplish this?  It is very useful to have clean URLs created in this way.  However, trying to get everything working with what is currently available usually requires a lot of effort and headache.  It seems that when something goes wrong, one can often expect it to be related to the SEF package they are using.

The reason I'm asking is that if readable SEF URLs were a core component, I think a lot more Joomla developers would focus on creating components and modules that are compatible with the SEF function.

The way it is now, you have to choose the SEF component based on the extensions you plan to use, and then hunt down hacked thirdparty sef_ext.php files etc. to make everything work.  And even still, there might be a few links lurking somewhere that are broken.

I did a search and didn't find info on this.  Sorry if it is a duplicate post.

Simple answer is yes. Is that enough or do you also need to developers-technical-answer ?

haha.  okay.  that is good news.  is there any ETA on when this will be available, or is it just going to be ready when it's ready?  I'm assuming all the bugs will need to be taken care of for 1.5 before the stable release, and then development on improving SEF will continue.  Having a stable, clean and readable URL solution as part of the core will be a huge improvement

It's already part of 1.5, if you download a nightly install it and have a look at the url's com_content generates you will be able to see what I mean. don't forget to turn SEF on, and in the request plugin make sure 'build with real names' is on too.

As an exmample 1.5 does something like :
http://localhost/joomla15/index.php/con ... content/41

Awesome!  I downloaded the initial beta release and played with it a bit.  I've got a couple websites just waiting for Joomla 1.5 and a couple more I'd like to migrate to 1.5 if possible.  It is exciting to know that real names SEF is already included.

Very good news, can't wait for willebils writeup on beta-2 once it's out to find out about other hidden goodies

thx god i will love to see this features in my next site Powered by Joomla 1.5

wow this is great did not expect this in the core in 1.5 anymore.

Sometimes it's just worth to have a look at what we are doing, instead of ranting about it  This has been in the core since october btw 

Yes, but never has there been any mention of the System Request Plugin and what it does.. Ignorance is no excuse, but no communication isn't either
Also, I guess you need to set "Build with Real Names" to Yes, AND activate mod_rewrite above, right?

Anyway, glad it's there, now we now.. include the info in the next blog, I'll also add a pic to the screenshots blog now

Hi Joe, good to see you back You don't need to activate mod_rewrite, works fine without it. Just turn SEF on make sure the plugin is published and voila all good to go.

I'm not back, I'm pirating someone elses WiFi (unsecured) to go online..
Still looking for a new house around Geneva, so no Internet
Planned for next month though -hopefully!

Screenshot now online: http://joomla15.blogspot.com/2007/01/se ... -core.html

i'm so happy to read this . sef url has become nigthmare for last 2 weeks because of opensef:)

Anything wrong with OpenSEF ?

In French, we'd call it an "usine a gaz", meaning there's much too many "features" in there which are not directly related to SEF URLs. Too much stuff all over the place, for me personally. I had one look, and never used it. Which doesn't mean some of it's functionality is bad..

OpenSEF works like a charm for me...

1.5 will not to be able to offer you the same functionality that OpenSEF does out of the box. We explicitly choose not to do tha since we don't believe a one solution fits all is possible. Different websites have different needs. 

What 1.5 does is offer alot of flexibility for third party developers to create humanly readible URL's. Flexibility is offered at two fronts, first of all component developers can define their own URL rewriting rules in 1.5 for their own component and second developers can also create plugins to globally change the URL rewriting behavior of 1.5. We hope that this will cover both the needs of third party component developers and from projects like OpenSEF and others.

- hope this won't be the case with the hyperflexible J 1.5 as well. Indeed an important reason for standardisation.

- looks promising. Though I hope this doesn't mean that ItemIDs issue persists, leading to Search Engine Unfriendly multiple URLs for same content.
Looks, to me, just a small step from enabling ability for URLs such as http://www.domain/category/item or http://www.domain/category/item.html.

OpenSEF works great for me. Easy enough to just use features you want.

- I'm curious re websites that would require URLs different to those OpenSEF can generate, as surely gives a strong, well-considered range of possibilities.


So, fits the "Joomla! - by Coders, for Coders" slogan I've suggested before. Never mind, perhaps, those who might just want to use this "easy to manage"  cms to create great websites, with strong, Cool URLs as foundation. 
Joomla - by Coders, for Webmasters, still something of a pipe dream?

Quite a number of webmasters use and love Joomla! ... I know lots

Louis

Might be interesting to survey them re desire for great, Cool URLs built into Joomla core.


searching for info on cms, just come across forum post by a webmaster, inc:

I doubt very seriously the outcome would determine whether or not they thought Joomla! was "for" them though...

Louis

But you haven't asked all these developers yet?
If webmasters are serious re creating great websites, will be an issue. Views of this thread - and the one on when SEF will be integrated in Joomla core - surely indicate this.

Also from forum thread I've just come across:

While aspects of what you say are certainly valid ... and no one on the development team doesn't want to improve things ... I would say that the number of sites using the software and the number of webmasters using the software would indicate that in fact webmasters don't feel that this software is "not" for them.

The power of our system is that it allows for things like openSEF to exist ... as well as artioSEF or whatever other SEF solution you want to deploy.

You don't have to use what you don't want to.  If openSEF works for you... use it.  If something else works for you... use it.  If you don't want to use Joomla! don't use it.  It is all about the power of choice.

Louis

Loius,



This sort of 'passing the buck' mentality persists across the entire project. Sure, there's been some positive gains for 1.5 in terms of human readability, but really, Mambo 4.6 Stable had it inbuilt 3 to 6 months ago (not to mention how far advanced Drupal and WP are beyond Mambo and J!). Whilst it may make business sense to open the market to alternative solutions (in this case, OpenSEF, Arturio, etc..), the underlying problems never get upgraded in line with current day web practices, solved or resolved because they are always 'alternative' instead of the standard and unable to be effectively integrated.



Two ramifications you're not considering:

• If none of the SEF solutions are proficient due to the limitations on core by the core
• You still want to use J! and have the best of both worlds (SEF and J!)

What choice is there in this instance ?

Simple... the choice is to use what you want to and what serves you best.

Done with this one now.

Louis

Thats pretty laughable if you think what CMS you are using out of the common open source options makes a significant difference in SEO.

I would actually argue that the devs have done the best thing here, laid the foundation. No disrespect to the devs, but I would imagine 99.99999999% of the devs working on Joomla, drupal, mambo.. whatever, are not hard core SEO experts. It seems to me the team has been wise enough to leave the development of specific SEO extensions to others. Then WE have the freedom to pick and choose rather than have a solution (which might not be the best option) forced on us.

Go Dev Team!

Barrie, let's compare the freedom of choice to delivery of a good product. Wordpress doesn't need any "specific SEO extensions" to make it work. Neither does Drupal. Merely because you percieve you have the freedom of choice doesn't mean that choice should stagnate or limit development (as seen by the showdown between J!, Drupal and Wordpress at Alledia).

In fact, the only marketplace I've found outside of J/Mambo in terms of requiring external 3rd party solutions (commercial or otherwise) for SEF is the .Net and Coldfusion space. Most PHP and Rails based apps these days know how this is done and do it inbuilt.

In the end, however, it comes down to demonstration and evidence, especially when we're talking about the quality and design of code in the SDLC.

Why is the path chosen able to demonstrate itself as the best option ?

Joomla 1.5 wont need any 3rd party extensions to "make it work" either. The output above will be quite sufficient for any needs you have with respect to SEO. Further refinements would not be a worthwhile use of dev time and resources imho.

OpenSEF wouldn't be coming out with a version for 1.5 if the inbuilt did "make it work" correctly, Barrie. The mere fact there's alternatives says the inbuilt isn't good enough, if nothing else. The dilemma is that the alternatives remain alternative..

in fact , opensef works perfect but one of my site has large content . that web site has over 12.000 items in jos_content table and opensef_rc5 is not usefull (high cpu and mysql usage, really high) for large web sites . i hope this bug for large web sites will be fixed in next opensef version