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I have tested http://extensions.joomla.org/extensions ... ards/21043

It removes the session cookie but replaces it with another cookie
It does not stop cookies from 3rd party extensions.

Having the message appear in the message area of the Template is a neat idea but has it's pitfalls.

Not had chance to test https://github.com/KISS-Web-Design/mod_cookiechoice yet

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that is the most apt, suitable, user warned text that could be found and understood.
basically, use at own risk

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Definitely use at your own risk. There is at least one extension that claims to block all cookies but only blocks the session cookie.

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After - and ONLY after the user has accepted - it sets a long-term cookie to store the decision, as well as allowing HTTP cookies and releasing the block on JS cookies.

I never claimed that it did.... In fact - I plainly state that it doesn't in the extension description.

Yes, my next version resolves that by providing 5 options for display.

Now, on to the real reason I'm replying...
Posting the negative review to my extension was unethical - as you are the author of a competing extension.

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i have read the review, and your response. This topic is not a debate on reviews, there is a separate forum for that. BUT have you tested webdongles free extension to see if it does what he says? (and i use nether of your extensions)

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His is a hit-and-miss - sometimes I get a _utma or _utmz cookie set, sometimes not.

That wasn't my point in replying. I wasn't disputing his review here because that's pointless - I was simply replying to negative comments (in this thread) about my extension - and stating that posting a review to a competing extension is unethical.

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N.B. not a personal attack. It is an observation of you contradicting yourself. I have no financial motive ... my extension is not Donation ware. My concern is that people are mistakenly thinking that their site is not dropping cookies.

Attached is proof that statement is incorrect


Not true you claim it blocks all cookies
"My solution was to put up a wall and declare "No Cookie" until such times as the user clicks a silly little button."
http://www.richeyweb.com/development/jo ... -directive

Your two quotes contradict each other so either you are deliberately trying to mislead or you can't remember what you say.


The following is a screen shot showing that the plugin does not stop Javascript cookies. The module 'London tube live' contains a link to a Javascript.

As the 'silly little button' has not been clicked and the site still puts the cookies on the computer ... the statement by stutteringp0et is incorrect.

If anyone wants a copy of the simple London tube module to test themselves they can do.

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You know as well as I do that the same-origin restriction prevents anything I do from preventing cookies set by javascript from another website.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Same_origin_policy

[Mod Note: Removed comment]
Browsing your site for only a short time gets me a couple of cookies - and it's not hard to get a session cookie - all I need to do is generate a 404 and I get one immediately. When multi-language is configured on my test site - your extension allows session and language cookies to get through!

[Mod Note: Removed comment]

Looks like in my last edit to the JED listing page, I removed the text regarding 3rd party cookies. My extension has been so popular that I've received a lot of feature requests that I've been fulfilling. The JED only provides so much space for an extension description that I eliminated some things in the last edit.

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And that is why I object to your documentation claiming that it does.




Erratic results from a computer is usually user error. Try deleting the cookies after The message tells you 'Any cookies placed on your computer will remain there until you delete them from your Browser'

First off my extension is not in competition to yours. Mine is not Donation ware therefore I have no financial incentive.

My incentive is to provide accurate tests. As a member of the Bugsquad I have learnt to test in a methodical manner. For you to suggest that my testing is biased, is a huge insult. My only motivation is to ensure that Joomla members are not mislead into thinking their site does not drop cookies when it does.

I speak as I find .. you claim something that has been proved incorrect. Please have the grace to accept your mistake instead of making personal attacks on my motives. Your continual denial of what has been proved only puts your word in question.

Please stop launching attacks on my ethics and test the way I did. You will soon see how the test results contradict your wording.

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I am not attacking your extension. I am pointing out that your wording is misleading. Your documentation claims the plugin stops all cookies.
"My solution was to put up a wall and declare "No Cookie" until such times as the user clicks a silly little button."


Perhaps read the documentation on my site ?
"Also please note that this module does not stop the session cookie or any cookies produced by your Template"
(I thought I also had that in the JED description but you know what thought did ... so will add it there also).

Again if you read the documentation on my site you will see "All modules and plugins that are set as 'Access' to 'View cookies' will only be activate when the visitor clicks the 'I accept cookies' button'."

By setting the language plugin view level to 'View cookies' then you will not get the cookies. Yes the multi language will not work until they click to Accept cookies. But that is why the messages says the site may not work correctly without cookies.

Please read the documentation and see what it is claimed that Kookie Grab does and does not stop.

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Donation ware? I get so few donations that I give the money to my wife. I might have received a couple hundred dollars TOTAL - not even enough to cover a fraction of my hosting costs.

And no response to the 404 method of getting past your extension? No response to getting cookies through your extension when multiple languages are enabled?

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It is good to remember that the purpose of the legislation is to protect the user from the activities of the website operator/owner in respect of what the cookie does.
We need to keep in mind that some of the cookies we are trying to block may have an exemption under Criterion A or B ( mostly likely B) That case is strengthened by the purpose of the unblocked cookie.



A more honest explanation on a web site of what cookies you will get and for what reason may be more fruitful than trying to pass the camel through the eye of the needle, and won't see you up before the "beak"
All bets are off when it comes to Analytics, Quantcast and Adsense...no excuse...no exemption.

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My reference to Donation ware was not aimed at you asking for donations. It was to point out that I have no financial motive.




Yes I responded please re read my previous post. It responds to that in detail.

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Hi
I am a newbie to all this cookie confusion. I have searched and searched for a solution. The two above that are being discussed i have tried and did not like the look & feel of them. Also they do not do what I want them to do.

I have noticed a few different ways of interpretation of the EU law and its solutions and have tried most i could find.

I have found some solutions stop session cookies but not third party ones such as google. Others do the opposite - stop third party cookies but not session ones.

My own interpretation on this, for what it is worth, is that the session ones are less important and the Google ads / analytics (third party) are more what the law is about. I therefore decided, rightly or wrongly, to block the third party cookies.

The above solution i use is http://chris-potter.co.uk/2012/05/eu-co ... la-plugin/

I know it still drops some cookies, prior to consent, however, there are links to our cookie privacy policy which explains the use of the different types of cookies we use. I also think its a pretty user interface.

What i would really like is for developers to get together to bring the joomla community a complete solution. Work together, Bash the two different types together into one solution.

A fully working solution that does stop ALL cookies until consent is given, is in such demand. This means it could have its development costs offset by charging for the solution. However, since the solution would be required by law, thus by thousands of joomla sites, the charge should be minimal (not for profit).

Yes agreed and that was the approach I've taken (sorry you don't like the look 'n' feel). But to find a simple solution without configuration is difficult because of all the different ways cookies can be placed.


More accurate to say it only stops 1 cookie and still drops everything else.


You might as well use an extension from http://extensions.joomla.org/extensions ... -a-iframes they do much the same thing except for the analytic cookie.

Many in the UK are adopting your interpretation that giving information (without the ability to prevent the cookies) is the legal interpretation. But don't forget other countries have different interpretations of the EU Directive.



Good luck on that one https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic ... zqHUf5BIH4

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Simplest answer I found was simply to host your site in the US or Canada, where such laws don't apply. Tell Europe that if the want to screw with web industry, we'll just move it elsewhere, and there goes their tax revenue!

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But if the owner of the site is in Europe ... does it matter where the site is hosted ?

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Yes, I think it's the physical location of the server that dictates the applicable law (I trained as a paralegal in the US, and that's how it generally works here). You may still have to pay taxes on your income based upon where you live or where your company is registered, and if you are a corporation, then you would have to follow the laws of the country you are incorporated in, but when it comes to what laws govern the intenet, it is based upon server location.

It reminds me of the US authorities trying to shut down illegal (here) file sharing sites that were hosted in russia. There wasn't anything they could do, because the US didn't have jurisdiction of those russian servers. The same rules would apply in this situation, I would think.

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http://webdesign.moonfireartstudios.com Joomla web design for small businesses

So you are saying if a Company registered in the UK has a website hosted on a non European server that the UK company are not subject to the UK/European laws on websites ?

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It depends on what laws you are talking about, and whether the "company" mentioned is a corporation or not. The simplest way would be to switch the coproration's registration to a non-european country. The host the server anywhere else but europe. You should be good in that instance.

{edit note: remember that the corporation is a separate legal entity. If you are incorporated, it acts like a separate person from you}

I can take a deeper look at the laws if it would be useful to the community. Keep in mind that I am NOT an attorney (barrister, solicitor, whatever...). Perhaps I can find an international Law attorney who would give me a free consultation for an open-source concern. I could make a few calls...

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Good luck on that one. I can see all the UK registered Companies changing their registration to a non EU country just to avoid making their site comply with the EU Directive

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I can too. The only problem is that the corporate tax level in the US is murder. That's why all of our corporations went to Switzerland and Ireland in the first place!

As for the I.L attorneys, so happens I know a couple. I hope that they can find it in their hearts to give me an hour or so on this, I think it's vital for the Joomla community, seeing as so many of them are based ineurope.

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The burned hand teaches best... - The Two Towers

http://webdesign.moonfireartstudios.com Joomla web design for small businesses

No, the US companies moved to the EU to avoid paying corporation tax on their worldwide earnings. It's called Tax Avoidance/Screwing the US public. Google for "Double Irish Dutch Sandwich"

The EU directive applies to any website that is intended or targeted at citizens of any EU country. The fact that enforcing it in the US or elsewhere is difficult/impossible unless the organisation has an EU presence to hit, does not make the Directive inapplicable to sites hosted in the US.

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A pretty business indeed for a man to be allowed eight hundred thousand sterling a year and worshipped into the bargain! Of more worth is one honest man to society...than all the crowned ruffians that ever lived. Paine 1776

Apparantly you are unaware of jurisdictional issues my friend. A body can make a law to say anything they want, but they still only have jurisdiction to apply it inside of their own borders, absent a treaty.

For example, Country A can say it's illegal for me to do act "B". But if I am doing said act in Country "C", there is not much they can do about it.

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Moonfireart, on the basis that "two thinks don't make a know" i suggest you may wish to contact the ICO and their respective European neighbours to ask for the position over European managed sites on non Europe hosted server.
Here is the thought to ponder. .Trade in our area, trade on our rules. ask your qualified lawyers and anyone else interested to visit
http://www.ico.gov.uk/for_organisations ... okies.aspx

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@Mandville

Your suggestion is taken to heart. As stated before, i am not a lawyer, only a paralegal. However, this issue is extremely important to a huge community of users (and companies). Therefore, I think it is worth the time and effort to do further research on this and get a professional opinion, which I will endeavor to do and bring back to this forum.

However, this issue may not be at rest until several court cases are tried and decisions issued. Things like this often aren't until then.

Trade in our area, trade on our rules really doesn't apply here though. You have no control over where in the world someone who accesses your site on a server is from. Although I grant you that it may apply to e-commerce sites, I think that may be the sticking point. Again, further research is indicated.

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Does anyone know if Joomla is going to put a cookie compliance widgit or built in solution into the next release. I am using the www.cookielaw.org plugin to find the cookies, but in truth i am really not that happy with it.
Anyone?

I do not believe that there is any intention for Joomla to address this issue. There is a strong school of thought that believes the liability is with the site owner only and that Joomla is supplied as Caveat Emptor. (A untested premise based on dodgy thinking, see posts above)
This is partly because of a misunderstanding that the EU uses a system of law similar in that to the USA where in fact the EU has 17 separate legal systems ranging from Corpus Juris Civilis to the Napoleonic Code and partly the reality that Joomla/OSM is registered in the USA and will only obey US Statute.

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A pretty business indeed for a man to be allowed eight hundred thousand sterling a year and worshipped into the bargain! Of more worth is one honest man to society...than all the crowned ruffians that ever lived. Paine 1776

@abernyte

While I agree with you on the fact that Joomla probably won't address this issue, and that many separate legal codes operate in the EU, the bottom line is that they have, no matter what their laws or codes state, ABSOLUTELY no jurisdiction to enforce those laws outside of their own borders, absent a treaty.

Should a EU country try to enforce the cookie law on a US citizen operating on a US server, just because some EU citizen visited or made a purchase on the site, it is my honest belief that our government would laugh heartily in their face. Other countries guard their jurisdiction jealously, absent a treaty.

Tell you what, I'll put my money where my mouth is. I am going to completely ignore the cookie law. I'll happily be the guinea pig. None of the sites I run will even attempt to comply with it. We'll see what happens.

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