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I had in mind to write a proper analysis with structured ideas for the promotion of Joomla! but unfortunately I don't currently have time... Instead I have just pared it down to the bare bones to outline my message.

I will be quite frank, I think that joomla has an image problem that is holding it back. It is very easy to under-estimate the power of design, but design governs a lot of decisions that people on a day to day basis. Just for the record - I really like Joomla! and I am only being tough as some aggressive decisions need to be made.

I feel that the current branding is a bit dated and clunky, and uses too many colours making it look cheap and child-like. Think: Apple logo from 1984 compared to Apple logo now... It really needs to be more web 2.0. lighter and 'cool', to be proud to use it and be evangelical about it.

I recently created a brand to promote a free online polls widget that worked quite well, http://www.polldaddy.com/, and ended up going viral (as was the intention) mostly down to the design and impact generated by the brand and website. (The build of the website was out of my control, or this would have been constructed with Joomla! also)

A good brand design and a really good web 2.0 style Joomla.org site layout and template design, will easily be included in all the high profile CSS galleries drawing loads of traffic from the main market I think you should be aiming at: Designers.

If designers consider this to be a serious and flexible tool, they can really push this system forward, quickly and high profile, which will in turn filter down through the web.

I have other ideas but I will save those for different threads - more to come...

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http://www.infinitimixedmedia.com
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Hi there,

Peter (M&M Leader) is away at the moment, but I'm certain he would be interested in your thoughts so hold tight for a response.

Cheers
Shayne

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http://www.cloudum.com Perth's Joomla! Development
http://www.nooku.org Home of Nooku Framework (koowa) the RAD development framework for Joomla!.

I agree with almost everything infinitimm has said. I wouldn't change the logo, but I think the design of the official Joomla! sites could stand an update. I'm sure this type of thing would coincide with porting the site to Joomla! 1.5, but I think it is needed.

Edited to add...
I should also add that the current design is good, and it has served the sites' purpose very well for the last year, but I think it is time for a redesign that would take Joomla! to the next level.

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http://www.corywebbmedia.com/
http://www.howtojoomla.net/

Hint : http://dev.joomla.org/component/option, ... ,33/p,227/, especially read the report from the Design and Accessibility work group. 

_________________
Johan Janssens - Joomla Co-Founder, Lead Developer of Joomla 1.5

http://www.joomlatools.eu - Joomla extensions that just work
http://www.nooku.org - Extension development framework for Joomla

Excellent! I can't wait to see the new design.

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http://www.corywebbmedia.com/
http://www.howtojoomla.net/

I do believe they're talking about the new design inside 1.5 (for Design issues) as Milkway is / was a template developed in transition (Rob and others have commented elsewhere about there being a second or new template for 1.5 Stable).

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Design with integrity : Web accessible solutions
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http://twitter.com/absalomedia

It seems to me like they are talking about redesigning the Joomla! home page.

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http://www.corywebbmedia.com/
http://www.howtojoomla.net/

And therein lies the problem... You cannot effectively design solutions by committee. In 13 years I have not seen it done successfully.

_________________
:: mean business ::
http://www.infinitimixedmedia.com
[If this helps, please pay it forward]

that's a bit unfair to make an assumption that there's a committee

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"Exploited yesterday... Hacked tomorrow"
Blog http://brian.teeman.net/
Joomla Hidden Secrets http://hiddenjoomlasecrets.com/

Mark -

Thanks for considering the Marketing and Media call for ideas. I was hoping you would help us with your vision on where things should head. BTW, I need to tell you, I stumbled on PollDaddy in my Internet travels; dude, that is sweet! I had no idea you were the designer on that!

We are starting to see world-class design talent creep in slowly and if we can trick them into contributing ideas ... and more ideas ... it will be very, very good for this project. And, as designers, such as Mark and Qasim Virjee (DesignGuru), get more attention and garner more CSS honors, etc., and people notice they are using Joomla!, this is obviously going to attract other reputable designers.

One thing is certainly true - designers have a unique way of looking at our world and, if empowered, can innovate in ways most of us cannot even dream of. Since this concept of "a new look" for joomla.org is already something the core team wants, I wonder if interested (and talented) designers could submit concepts to the core and perhaps we can start harnessing some of this amazing talent. (Maybe the new design is already in place - I don't know - this is only a suggestion.)

For those who have not seen Mark's work, check out his showcase thread < http://forum.joomla.org/index.php/topic,113168.0.html >.

Mark - please do continue to submit more ideas. Thank you for your contributions!
Amy

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http://Twitter.com/AmyStephen
http://www.alltogetherasawhole.org/

Ok, sorry, just a term of phrase. Let me clarify - multiple design input and direction, with consideration for multiple markets, with the aim of a single outcome or solution. Better? Maybe you would be happier with the word 'consensus'?

I am not criticising, I really like Joomla! and will continue to use it. But when you ask me what I think...guess what? I tend to tell you. 

I am offering my professional opinion here at no charge, and my motive was to start a thread so ideas could be discussed, however, this hasn't been productive so I am not going to spend any more time on it. Like you (brian) I am a little bit unsure about the efficacy, or even the point, of this forum...

_________________
:: mean business ::
http://www.infinitimixedmedia.com
[If this helps, please pay it forward]

OK understand you now and agree with the sentiment but without knowedge of who is working on a new site design its a bit unfair to come to any conclusion. For all we know it is one person designing a new site with a few other people giving feedback and testing.


Please do. Those of us that care about Joomla should never be afraid to speak our minds. If we dont then nothing will ever grow/change/progress/improve (delete as appropriare)


Well with a bit of luck (and I know some core people are pushing for this) this forum will start to be active and have a real purpose.

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"Exploited yesterday... Hacked tomorrow"
Blog http://brian.teeman.net/
Joomla Hidden Secrets http://hiddenjoomlasecrets.com/

Hi all,

It seems lot's of wrong assumptions are being made in this thread. To avoid further misinterpretation ...

@infinitimm

In your first post you write : 'I had in mind to write a proper analysis with structured ideas for the promotion of Joomla! but unfortunately I don't currently have time... Instead I have just pared it down to the bare bones to outline my message.'

While we truly appreciate your feedback I regret the fact that you are not willing to help action your ideas. Joomla!, being an truly opensource project can only moved forward if people are not only willing to voice their ideas but also wanna help make to them happen.

I don't agree with you that design 'by commitee' doesn't work. If you have experience in bigger webdesign projects you will know that designing a site is always a team effort that requires many different skillsets.

@All

As we wrote in the week in review post a few weeks ago the Design team (which is part of the bigger Design and Accessibility working group) is indeed working on a redesign for the Joomla! websites. The report also mentions the people that are working on this, a reader that reads carefully will notice that it is a 2 man team that is doing the actuall design work. Both are amongst the finest designers we have in our community.

Re-designing the Joomla! sites is not an easy task. We are not taking about just one re-design, instead we need to redesign 6 sites. Each of them has a seperate target audience, goals and flow. The only thing we can tell you at the moment is that a re-design is in process and that it will take time. We can only communicate more in detail once we have some initial results to show.

_________________
Johan Janssens - Joomla Co-Founder, Lead Developer of Joomla 1.5

http://www.joomlatools.eu - Joomla extensions that just work
http://www.nooku.org - Extension development framework for Joomla

@jinx
You don't agree - that's fine. From your typos it would appear that you are taking this quite personally. I won't be drawn into an argument with you or qualify my experience. If you want to contact me directly rather than just quote me and pick at the words, you can send me a message.

_________________
:: mean business ::
http://www.infinitimixedmedia.com
[If this helps, please pay it forward]

we all suffer from typos. for me itis because i typefast and my right hand actualy typesfaster than my left.. which together wih poor spelling leads to lots of typos. for others it is because english is not their first language.
[me=brian]in awe of those who speak english and php as well as their birth language[/me]

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"Exploited yesterday... Hacked tomorrow"
Blog http://brian.teeman.net/
Joomla Hidden Secrets http://hiddenjoomlasecrets.com/

@infinitimm

Some typos fixed, not sure I got them all, not natively english speaking and not always time to drag all my posts through a spellchecker. If my post personaly attacked you then I apologise for that. This was not my intention.

I merely wanted to point out that we have lot's of people coming in with their own ideas and thoughts. Some with professional experience and most of them not. We don't really care, in opensource everbody starts from the bottom.

What is most important for us is if new people wanna help make good things happen. We don't really care how that happens as long as it happens, being that by committee, working group, team, consensus, ... If a group of people accepts a certain collaboration model and is able to produce results then we will support them.

You definitly seem experienced and I don't want to argue that. I didn't agree with your statement that's all. Next time maybe try a simple : 'how can I help ?' You will be surprised how far it will get you.

_________________
Johan Janssens - Joomla Co-Founder, Lead Developer of Joomla 1.5

http://www.joomlatools.eu - Joomla extensions that just work
http://www.nooku.org - Extension development framework for Joomla