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PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 9:50 pm 
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Short, but interesting article cites Big Blue sentiments regarding split:

http://news.com.com/2061-10795_3-590678 ... &subj=news


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 10:22 pm 
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I think that we all agree with Mr. Smith's stated concerns.

Thanks for posting this article. Its always interesting to see how closely larger businesses are watching the open-source movement.

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 21, 2005 10:22 pm 
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I though it was quite positive towards Joomla 8)

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 9:00 am 
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brad wrote:
I though it was quite positive towards Joomla 8)

I very much agree with this :)

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 12:05 pm 
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I wasn't referring to the tone of the article because you are correct, it does focus on the positive aspects of Joomla (before meandering into the completely unrelated subject of AJAX ;))

I was speaking specifically about Mr. Smith's concern for Joomla popularity especially within the business sector as a result of the spoon or spork or whatever.
[quote="original linked article"]"It does look like the company that was shepherding this along got a little bit off track on their interests vs. the open-source community's interests," said Rod Smith, vice president of emerging Internet technology for IBM's Software Group, in an interview Tuesday. "That's a bad thing," because Mambo had a lot of traction, and the "fork" undermines that, he said.

Corporate customers dislike such conflicts, Smith said. "They're not scared of open-source software. But what they are scared of is what just happened to Mambo," he said. "If it blows up on them, they might have to do a lot of rework." [/quote]

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 10:38 pm 
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there seemed to be a mixed tone in the article, and frankly I don't agree that the "fork" is what scares the executives; I would guess most executives, and I know for certain the ones I know, are looking far beyond "saving money with Open Source".

"They're not scared of open-source software. But what they are scared of is what just happened to Mambo," he said. "If it blows up on them, they might have to do a lot of rework."  But what garauntee that the commercial software you buy can't blow up and go a different direction, a company go bankrupt, or any number of things that have and do happen.  This is something we are all scared of when we implement software regardless of open-source or not.

Personally I think that most execs look at what happened and say that's a reason to support Open Source because if a company "... that was shepherding this along got a little bit off track on their interests vs. the open-source community's interests." - Joomla! proves that you do have an alternative when that happens.  Frankly, those companies should financially support the growth of Joomla! through corporate adoption and financial support in the true sense of open source.

Now I think the CTO guy was impressed as am I - Joomla! rocks.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:05 pm 
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T3.6K - I think that you give company exectives a lot of credit here! ;) I wish that CTOs and their employees had more time to investigate and research open-source solutions like Joomla but the reality that Mr. Smith describes is most likely what is taking place in corporate offices around the world today. Joomla evangelists (like myself) are actively involved with the developments of the project but we can't expect companies seeking tech solutions to have time to research all the solutions available. As Mr. Smith points out, issues like the recent breakup in $ambo / Joomla world exponentially increase the time it takes to get a firm handle on what is available and what the full story is with the solution.

If a commercial solution breaks you call the company you purchased it from for support. We have long heard this argument for Micro$oft (ASP) as opposed to PHP and other open-source languages. As a result, Zend (the company behind PHP) has been spending a LOT of time developing support and training networks to help respond to this issue. The $ambo Foundation was originally intended to create these networks for $ambo but with the breakup there has been no time to focus on these issues for Joomla. This is a major hurdle in Joomla's race to success, IMHO.

Another issue is that many companies I've spoken with do not want to be on the "bleeding edge" when it comes to their technology solutions. Open-source solutions are perceived to be closer to this edge than commercial solutions. Companies generally seek a relationship with a reputable provider to develop a custom solution thus maintaining this myth of stability and flexibility. Many companies have found out sooner than later that their custom solution is very expensive and its stability and flexibility to be entirely dependent on the solutions provider's staff and project load.

Lucky for us this is where the Joomla community comes in! We can counteract the effects of these fear, uncertainty, and doubt (FUD) tactics of commercial solutions by creating great materials for our local evangelists to utilize. We need to create fabulous PR materials that deal directly with these misconceptions and are written with potential businesses as the target audience. We can get the word out in our local community by making other local developers and tech solutions providers aware of Joomla. Consider delivering a presentation focused on creating business solutions to local tech councils and user groups and encourage them to invite local business owners. Advertise in local magazines and newspapers that you have a Joomla solution. This general awareness of Joomla and its features will go a long way to erasing some of these misconceptions about Joomla as a project and open-source as a business solution.

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Last edited by gsbe on Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:09 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:24 pm 
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gsbe - I agree that there is always a bunch of corporate think, but I know a bunch of really smart CTOs and the market tides are turning towards Open Source.  Selling beyond the spin "of commercial support" is certainly always one of the hurdles, but having been corporate executive I know that I can get bug fixes from my commercial suppliers most of the time  :( - but getting the functionality I was promised in a timely fashion is another issue completely.

Quote:
Many companies have found out sooner than later that their custom solution is very expensive and its stability and flexibility to be entirely dependent on the solutions provider's staff and project load.
  Truer words have never been written.

Luckily the commercial suppliers are helping do our "evangelical work" by launching "Open Source" projects, supporting OSS, and beginning to see the light - including Big Blue.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:36 pm 
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Interesting thoughts folks.

Fact is there is more interesting collaboration likely with Joomla! than we could possibly have had before. And it's not all about working in enterprise arenas. We've had much more contact and support from other open source projects since the spoon.

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Last edited by mediamagnate on Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:39 pm 
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mediamagnate wrote:
Fact is there is more interesting collaboration likely in with Joomla! than we could possibly have had before. And it's not all about working in enterprise arenas. We've had much more contact and support from other open source projects since the spoon.

Excellent, glad to hear this. Any plans to create new PR materials for local evangelists? I can volunteer to provide assistance with this if you need it, Peter.

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PostPosted: Mon Oct 24, 2005 11:43 pm 
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gsbe wrote:
mediamagnate wrote:
Fact is there is more interesting collaboration likely in with Joomla! than we could possibly have had before. And it's not all about working in enterprise arenas. We've had much more contact and support from other open source projects since the spoon.

Excellent, glad to hear this. Any plans to create new PR materials for local evangelists? I can volunteer to provide assistance with this if you need it, Peter.


:)

As if you don't have enough on your plate Graham!

I'll PM you.

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