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Hello My name is TJ, and I'm back once again to the Joomla! forum  (you couldn't get rid of me ).
I am now doing the task to do a tri-fold brochure answering the following:

I don't see a freedom 4 on any of the sources provided for information, but I see a 3; is that what was meant by 4? This task has a pretty well laid out guideline for what is wanted so I will try to have a content document up by tomorrow evening. Thanks Everyone!

Google Task[me=AmyStephen]modified title and added Google task link[/me]

Yes, TJ, you are right

Just a comment: there are really interesting transcripts of Mr. Stallman on the FSF website. It worth the reading.

_________________
...nam qui dabat olim imperium, fasces, legiones, omnia, nunc se continet atque duas tantum res anxius optat, panem et circenses...
http://www.todosjuntos.org
http://inmo-e.com

Here is my proposed content take a look at it and let me know what you think. I am interested in reading those transcripts but i cant find them. Also any editing that anyone could do would be apreciatd. Thaknks i will wait for some feedback then start on my first brochure draft. 

LOVE IT, tj! 

Maybe add Linux to the examples of free software?

Honestly, you hit the points I wanted this piece to hit.

Great work!
Amy

_________________
http://Twitter.com/AmyStephen
http://www.alltogetherasawhole.org/

http://www.fsf.org/events/past-rms-speeches.html
http://www.fsf.org/resources/what-is-fs
http://www.fsf.org/resources/testimonials

http://www.gnu.org/philosophy/philosophy.html
http://www.gnu.org/links/

My bad, I use to point things without a link, and a link is worth a thousand pics...

Your draft is OK but, IMO, there are some key points that should be included. You will get them specially in the Philosophy section

_________________
...nam qui dabat olim imperium, fasces, legiones, omnia, nunc se continet atque duas tantum res anxius optat, panem et circenses...
http://www.todosjuntos.org
http://inmo-e.com

If you do include Linux, make sure you call it "GNU/Linux".  rms says that it "preserves the freedom".


-Do you mean "whether"

Also, you should add Apache to the list of Free Software, and mention that it is used on X% of websites (if you can find that statistic)
Another topic you may want to consider adding is the confusion between the terms "free software" and "open source", including how they are the same and how they are different, and why to use one over the other.

Looks like a great outline!

P.S.-This is a great video to watch if you get the chance.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 4188526128

_________________
Leonard Bernstein for President -
Web Development Services: www.BernsteinForPresident.com
My Software Freedom Blog: Trombonechamp.Wordpress.com

TJ, I would spend some time reading, may be using paper and pencil (I am too old, may be you might want to use Google's notebook, lol).

Take notes, some key points will be very easy to find. Don't think just about software, this game isn't about technical specs and we don't mind about it because it is just a question of time to get there (ie. photoshop vs the gimp).

_________________
...nam qui dabat olim imperium, fasces, legiones, omnia, nunc se continet atque duas tantum res anxius optat, panem et circenses...
http://www.todosjuntos.org
http://inmo-e.com

tj -

I wanted to tell you how pleased I am with your approach. You are someone who does a great job of listening and adapting. With your last tri-fold, you presented it for the first time in nearly complete form - words and formatting. Then, we asked you to drop back to the beginning and revisit content. This ended up causing you rework. But, you were not discouraged - you did not display "attitude" - you did not act defensive - you just kept improving your work, over and over, and taking each step in sequence, until it was done.

I am so impressed with that attitude - it will take you a long ways in life.

When you took this next task - another tri-fold - I was impressed when you started with message - and left formatting for later. You are learning and you are adapting so that your work is more useful to the community.

I'd really like you to work closely with Rafa (ibnhafsun) on this piece. He is very knowledgeable about free software. I learn from him always. We need to better educate our community on what free software is and what it is not and why this matters. I know the two of you will work together very well.

And, of course, as before, with everyone else who is kind enough to share their impressions and ideas - please do - it is so very helpful. Max - as usual - you rock. You do a lot for each of these entries, and therefore, for our community.

Thanks!
Amy

_________________
http://Twitter.com/AmyStephen
http://www.alltogetherasawhole.org/

Great feedback, and will do! about my incorrect spelling of "whether" i did mean that, i must  of accidentally chosen weather in spellcheck thanks for pointing that out. I will read it more closely next time after i run spellcheck. I will try to have a new content page up by tomorrow or earlier if i get the time. Thanks!

I'm doing some more research on the new links provided and have a question, is this to be informative or persuasive? Am i to be persuading others to use free software or just informing them on what free software is and what it does? Thanks i will definitely have the new info up by tomorrow. 

I had more free time than i thought. While i did not have enough time to watch the video provided, i did try to read over all the links to the different essays. I hope i hit all the points that you wanted to see in this brochure and i hope i did not take a step backwards. Let me know what you think! I get off for winter break tomorrow so i will have more time to make changes over the next few days so keep telling me what you want fixed (hopefully no more embarrassing spell check errors  ). Thanks for the continued support!

ps: ( i don't know how to use google notebooks i still use a pen and paper, your not that old)

Just a suggestion: it should be, IMO, informative, persuasive and... funny!

Free Software philosophy is usually hard to explain. It implies morals, ethics, intentions...

I miss the copyleft concept (what, why...).

_________________
...nam qui dabat olim imperium, fasces, legiones, omnia, nunc se continet atque duas tantum res anxius optat, panem et circenses...
http://www.todosjuntos.org
http://inmo-e.com

Ok will do, i take the

to mean that i need to add some about copyleft, and i will try my hardest to make it funny, informative and persuasive. I will have a new content page up tonight.

The history of the word "copyleft" is funny, in addition to the word itself.  rms' biography, "Free as in Freedom", gives us this paragraph about Copyleft.


This may or may not help, but I though it might be useful to you.

_________________
Leonard Bernstein for President -
Web Development Services: www.BernsteinForPresident.com
My Software Freedom Blog: Trombonechamp.Wordpress.com

here is my first attempt i call it the hitchhikers guide to free software.  It is my style of humor but i tried to keep it at a minimum to keep content and persuasion the biggest concepts. I am getting worried about the length for my last brochure i had one page and i had too much in  some areas. Let me know what you think trombonechamp you rock, you are so helpful, i got your post right before i typed this so i already had the edits done but if i need to make more changes i will try to implement that little bit on copyleft, it is funny! Thanks everyone for your continued support!

Oooooh!  Red flag!

From rms:

Yeah... Moving right along


When describing the four freedoms, one thing you may want to do is use the same analogy.  For example, using software that would clean out the empty space between your teeth from freedom 0.  For freedom 1, you could put something along the lines of being able to modify it to give you a teeth whitening as well, freedom 2 is to let your friend clean their empty space between their teeth, etc.


You should probably get rid of the "willingly".  "Average" people don't know anything about software freedom.


GNU/Linux has the most advanced graphical user interface on the planet, Compiz-Fusion.  It makes Vista look like it goes with that $4,000 computer you bought in '94. (yet for some reason it requires a $4,000 graphics card that goes in your $8,000 computer you bought last week. Great job M$)


You make it sound like it is a lot of work to learn free software alternatives.  Openoffice, Joomla!, PCLOS, etc. have proven that wrong. (Just pretend like blender doesn't exist...  )

_________________
Leonard Bernstein for President -
Web Development Services: www.BernsteinForPresident.com
My Software Freedom Blog: Trombonechamp.Wordpress.com

You are doing a nice work, TJ

You tried to find analogies. That's the best way to explain it, IMO. However, if you do it that way someone could get it wrong (we don´t want them to get pissed off, we want them laughing and thinking). In some countries Nazi, fascist or communist are heavy words and should be used careful.

An example about the freedoms kinds of freedom (edited) (one that RMS uses to expose first on his talks) is cooking too.
http://fsfe.org/en/fellows/ciaran/ciara ... ke-cooking

Why is it a good example?
It doesn't hurt! Even Ferran Adria shares his recipes!

_________________
...nam qui dabat olim imperium, fasces, legiones, omnia, nunc se continet atque duas tantum res anxius optat, panem et circenses...
http://www.todosjuntos.org
http://inmo-e.com

I was worried about that.  I will work on finding different analogies. I will have a new content page up by this afternoon.

Ok i like the cooking analogy, i like cooking  so because i could not think of a better analogy i implemented this throughout the whole thing. Let me know what you think and if anyone has any ideas for some better analogy's please let me know.

I've found the idea funny (but take in mind that I am Spaniard and my sense of humour is.. a bit special) and sweet.

It should work. This is a trifold brochure so you'll need some spice to add to your sweet cakes

_________________
...nam qui dabat olim imperium, fasces, legiones, omnia, nunc se continet atque duas tantum res anxius optat, panem et circenses...
http://www.todosjuntos.org
http://inmo-e.com

I like the cake analogy.  It makes it much easier to follow with only one analogy.  Have you heard the book/translator analogy?  It is mostly used to refer to the DMCA/DRM, but could be tweaked to apply to FOSS/Proprietary software as well.  Basically, you buy a book, but it is in a language that nobody but the publishing company speaks.  If you want to read it, you have to hire one of their translators.  Then, the publishing company holds onto your book for you to make sure you don't give it away to anyone else or teach yourself to read that language.  Personally, I like your cake analogy better, but I just thought I would throw this out there.


You may or may not want to put this in there.  Under the GPL this is true, but remember that BSD licensed programs are free software too.  You don't have to promise to share that with other people.


This sentence jumps straight from cakes back to software, which makes it seem a little choppy.  You may want to move it or add something there to ease the transition.

_________________
Leonard Bernstein for President -
Web Development Services: www.BernsteinForPresident.com
My Software Freedom Blog: Trombonechamp.Wordpress.com

i am not quit sure what is meant by this statement 

i take it to mean either that you want me to start on the actual brochure, or you want me to add some more enjoyable content.


i fixed those problems you pointed out trombonechamp and as always THANK YOU! i glanced right over them in my read over. Here is the new content, i only made changes to that one paragraph.

You three are really doing some great teamwork in here!

Now, for some reason, I am hungry for cake. Not just any cake, either, something that I can adapt for my own needs and share with my family for our holiday meal. If it's really good, someone might ask for my recipe. I am happy to share. It's good that I will not require an attorney to do so!

Keep up the good work!
Amy

_________________
http://Twitter.com/AmyStephen
http://www.alltogetherasawhole.org/

Hello everyone, sorry i have not replied in a while i have been baking massive amounts of cookies for friends and neighbors. Happy Holidays! I will try to have a draft of the brochure up by tomorrow, thanks. 

Hello everyone. Here is my first brochure draft, i had to re-edit almost everything so it would fit so let me know if there is anything i need to have but accidentally cut out. I combined the free software definition and the open source clarification, shortened the free software list, and everything else. I will be unavailable tomorrow due to Christmas, but i might could get another draft up tonight if i get replies soon. Once again Happy Holidays. 

ps. i hope the open office draw format is still ok

-I know the brochure is supposed to be fun, but your font is hard to read.  You should stick to Halvetica.
-In each of the freedoms, you say, "Freedom X is, The freedom to...".  This would be more readable if it were said as, "Freedom X: The freedom to...".
-Alot is not a word.  "A lot" is.

This is a run on.  Change it to:

-Make sure you decide on what words to capitalize in the titles of the panels.

-Change the last paragraph in "Copyleft" to:



Change to:


I like the analogy, but the only thing that sounds absurd in it is the fact that if you ask for the recipe, you get sued.  It may be hard for people to relate to.  Have you "hurd" (Hey, I'm not an rms at puns!!!) the one about the car?  You "purchase" the car from the dealer, but the hood is locked shut and the tires are locked on.  The dealer is the only one with the key.  To make sure you didn't break the lock, you are required to check in with the dealer every 3 months.  If you miss the appointment, your car will stop running.  It is also against the law to give other people rides in your car.  There is a camera in the car as well so the dealer can see if you give other people rides.
Wow, that would be hard to explain in a panel!  Maybe you should stick to the cake.

_________________
Leonard Bernstein for President -
Web Development Services: www.BernsteinForPresident.com
My Software Freedom Blog: Trombonechamp.Wordpress.com

Thank you so much for your input trombonechamp! please ignore any spelling issues in this post, i am doing it on my pocket pc (even built in spell check doesn't work in ie mobile, i haven't found a good alternative yet). I don't know what my day tomorrow will be like so i can not garentee a new edit to be up by tomorrow but i will try my hardest. i can definently tell you that i will have a new draft up by Thursday evening. i would still love to hear anyone else's input. I hope everyone had a merry Christmas, ant thanks again!

http://www.mozilla.org/projects/minimo/
I think it has spell check like FF, could be wrong

Even better:
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_z ... _ziff44392

_________________
Leonard Bernstein for President -
Web Development Services: www.BernsteinForPresident.com
My Software Freedom Blog: Trombonechamp.Wordpress.com

Thank you  trombonechamp for the suggestions, minimo took over five minutes to load on my ppc and i can't wait that long to lode a ppc app, and i have some software i need which keeps me too windows mobile. However the software is moving over to android and so i am planing to switch over if i can.

I fixed the problems with the first draft, changed fonts (all except the heading fonts so let me know if you still think there a problem), and changed everything else. I decided to stick to the cake analogy but tried to change it so it makes more sense. Thank's everyone! 

it has been 24 hours since i uploaded my last draft so since i have heard no feedback i would like to submit this draft for a final review. Thanks for all the help everyone!