Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

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Elephantman
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Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by Elephantman » Mon Apr 23, 2007 3:41 pm

Hi there,

I'm starting up a big scale project that is due for production in january 2008. One of the first questions that needs answering is : should we use 1.5 API for developping our components, or prefer 1.0.x ?

If we go for 1.0.x, we will have consistent documentation, and there will be many many developpers out here with the knowlege to help us if we encounter any problems. It will also be a ultra stable basis, and all existing components we will use are sure to work correctly as they have been written for 1.0.x. On the other hand, we will probably be outdated quite fast, and we will not benefit from the major improvements that come with 1.5.

If we go for 1.5, the API will be more difficult to learn as there is much less documentation, but the tools are more powerfull and we will be better prepared for future evolution. There is also the risk of there not being a stable version early enough as even the beta is being delayed month after month, and the existing components we will use may not be performant enough using the legacy system.

So what do you guys think ? Should we devellop our project on a 1.0.x basis, on on a 1.5 ?

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by Asphyx » Mon Apr 23, 2007 4:21 pm

Use the stable 1.0X...

First off there may not be anything in 1.5 that makes it worth the risk of not having a stable code...
and who knows what may happen between then and now to delay the project?

You know you can migrate the 1.0X site to 1.5 when it is avalable...
You don't know if that will be possible if you build it with a beta that changes so much it can't be migrated.

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by Jonah » Mon Apr 23, 2007 8:46 pm

Two questions: How much extension development will you be doing?  What is the life expectancy of the site?

If the answers are lots and long I would suggest going with J1.5.  The framework is much nicer to use and more powerful.  The future of Joomla! is in the 1.5 and beyond, Joomla 1.0 will begin to stagnate (although very slowly) after 1.5 is released as stable.  Yes you might have to maintain some core patches while 1.5 matures, but if you have the proper dev team as you should for a large project this should not be a problem.

Disclaimer: Obviously your development team should consider all the options and not blame us when you make the wrong decision.  :-)
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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by Elephantman » Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:56 am

Asphyx wrote: You know you can migrate the 1.0X site to 1.5 when it is avalable...
You don't know if that will be possible if you build it with a beta that changes so much it can't be migrated.
This is the whole issue. Can we really migrate the code ? Legacy module doesn't seem so perfect, and I have nno clue if it will be efficient load wise on a big audience website.
lamad wrote: Two questions: How much extension development will you be doing? 
Quite a lot, it's planned to be 9 months developper work (spread out on 2 developpers) on a full time basis + 6 months of project managers time and xhtml/css coding.
lamad wrote:What is the life expectancy of the site?
As long as possible. 3 years seels to be a minimum to me.

lamad wrote:Disclaimer: Obviously your development team should consider all the options and not blame us when you make the wrong decision.  :-)
Indeed, I'm just seeking extra advice that could point out things we have not thought about.
Last edited by Elephantman on Tue Apr 24, 2007 11:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by Jonah » Tue Apr 24, 2007 2:08 pm

Elephantman wrote:
Asphyx wrote: You know you can migrate the 1.0X site to 1.5 when it is avalable...
You don't know if that will be possible if you build it with a beta that changes so much it can't be migrated.
This is the whole issue. Can we really migrate the code ? Legacy module doesn't seem so perfect, and I have nno clue if it will be efficient load wise on a big audience website.
Ya, you can migrate a component to J1.5....  by rewriting it.  :P  Well, not totally, but the two frameworks are different.  Personally, I would consider Joomla 1.5 to be 2.0, it's that big of a change.

I would recommend Joomla 1.5.  It's not for the faint of heart and your will need to adapt to the bumps on the road to stable but it will save you time and grief in the long run.  Just my unofficial two cents.  ;)
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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by ianmac » Tue Apr 24, 2007 2:10 pm

I would develop content with 1.0, and develop extensions for 1.5.  The 1.5 API should be fairly stable, and although it likely will change, the modifications required for your code should be minimal.  There will be a migration path from 1.0 to 1.5 to migrate all of your content.  But, the stable release of 1.5 might need a database upgrade against the current 1.5 nightly, so it won't be as easy to move your content.

By developing content for 1.0, you can create a fresh install of the stable, migrate your content over, and then install your extensions.  If your extensions don't mess with the core data, you don't have to worry much about migrating them - just install your extensions and copy your database tables.

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by Elephantman » Tue Apr 24, 2007 4:50 pm

Data is not a question for several months, the only job really starting soon is the developpement of our components and modules.

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by draculinos » Tue Apr 24, 2007 5:15 pm

Do we have any estimated time for the 1.5 release ?

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by jherich » Fri Apr 27, 2007 6:22 pm

I thought we were not going to be able to upgrade 1.0 sites to 1.5 or later.  Thats the reason it was very difficult for me to choose 1.0 over 1.5

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by ianmac » Fri Apr 27, 2007 7:03 pm

There will be no upgrade path.

But, the articles that you create in Joomla! 1.0 (those that are managed by the com_content component), will be able to be migrated from 1.0 to 1.5.  This means creating a new install of 1.5 and using the migrate component that will be available for 1.0 to move the content to 1.5.

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by jherich » Fri Apr 27, 2007 7:41 pm

Thanks,

Would this mean with the exceptionof my after market components and mods, my site would pretty much work the same in 1.5

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by ianmac » Fri Apr 27, 2007 9:32 pm

I would expect so, with possibly a minor bit (if any) of configuration.

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by tcp » Sat Apr 28, 2007 2:25 am

Personally, I think it's safe to do serious site and extension development after Beta 2.  After this point, the framework is 99.9% set and the remaining work will be in testing, security, and bug fixing.  Currently 99% of features work but as Ian pointed out in another post changes are still being made to the framework.  Beta 2 should signify "framework complete".

I would work w/ 1.5 .

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by draculinos » Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:50 am

Any estimated time for the release of beta 2 and the final release 1.5 stable?

ok I see now the post about the dates  :(
Last edited by draculinos on Sun Apr 29, 2007 10:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by Elephantman » Sun May 06, 2007 6:27 am

Now beta 2 is out, do you have any extra opinions about this issue ?

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Re: Should I use 1.5 for a big project due in january 2008 ?

Post by Jonah » Wed May 09, 2007 3:27 pm

Beta 2 marks that point at which features are generally considered stable.  Most work will be on bug fixing and ensuring quality now.  While this is true and could almost mean open season for extension development, please not the emphasis on generally.  :)
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