Reporting an extension is futile

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Webdongle
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Reporting an extension is futile

Post by Webdongle » Thu May 07, 2020 3:00 pm

I reported an extension for broken links and got a ridiculous reply
Re: Extension Report
Message: Hello1 Thank you for your report! Since is a commercial listing, we can't fully test the process. However we notified the author about the problem. You should contact them directly with the problem - we have absolutely no control over his site. If he fails to fix the problem, please, report us back, to be able to take futher steps. Based on our TOS this is a commercial problem, and we can't interfere in commercial disputes other way than suggesting you possible ways of solutions. Fingers crossed!
What fool wrote that twaddle? It is totally irrelevant to the report. The report was about broken link. If JED team don't mind broken kinks then fine. But they should not reply with irrelevant garbage.
http://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/
https://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/updating-joomla.html
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results": Albert Einstein.

 
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sozzled
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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by sozzled » Thu May 07, 2020 8:37 pm

1) I have some sympathy for @Webdongle (and other people who use the JED).

2) I agree with the JED policy that ought to protect suppliers/developers/those-who-list-their-products to prevent the possibility that any one person, making a claim about "broken links" should have their product(s) de-listed.

3) There needs to be some rigour in the process. Making a report (and asking the JED to investigate) could be sending the JED team members on unnecessary excursions that establish nothing.

In summary, I agree that people should be able to report whatever they want to report and I appreciate the efforts made by the JED team to keep things clean. Stay cool. 8)
https://www.kuneze.com/blog
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Webdongle
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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by Webdongle » Thu May 07, 2020 9:22 pm

But the point is they should have replied either that they are not bothered about broken links or that they checked it was broken. But they did neither ... their reply was totally unrelated to the report.
http://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/
https://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/updating-joomla.html
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results": Albert Einstein.

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sozzled
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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by sozzled » Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:44 pm

Webdongle wrote:
Thu May 07, 2020 3:00 pm
I reported an extension for broken links ...
I know that this is a cause of @Webdongle's frustration with the JED system but the information given in the JED team's reply is worth considering.

I won't dwell on another conversation we've had about JED team delving into matters that should not be of concern to them except to quote [again] from the JED terms of service page (Section 11) that clearly states the JED's limitation of responsibility:
The listings and reviews listed in the JED have been submitted by the community and are for general informational purposes only. Listings do not constitute or imply endorsement, recommendation, or favoring by Joomla or OSM.

Because the listings and reviews are provided by others, Joomla, OSM, and the JED team cannot be held liable for accuracy of the information. Visitors wishing to verify that the information is correct should contact the parties responsible for creating the content of the resource.
That's precisely the point that's made in the reply:
Thank you for your report! Since is a commercial listing, we can't fully test the process. However we notified the author about the problem. You should contact them directly with the problem - we have absolutely no control over his site. If he fails to fix the problem, please, report us back, to be able to take futher steps. Based on our TOS this is a commercial problem, and we can't interfere in commercial disputes other way than suggesting you possible ways of solutions. Fingers crossed!
It disturbs me that that automated processes (generated by the JED system) periodically browse listings in the JED for the purposes of checking the currency/accuracy of listing content. It would equally disturb me if people browse the JED listings only for those same purposes. I'm not accusing the OP of doing this; I'm confident that the OP's intentions were innocent: browse the JED, find a product, read the product description, attempt to access the product ... and fail in the process. These things happen from time to time. The information in the JED is taken on faith: the JED team cannot be held liable for accuracy of the information. Therefore, reporting these irregularities to the JED is, at best, hopeful that the JED could intervene and take action.

The JED team reply, quoted in the original post, was not automated; it was a canned reply. I infer from the typographical and grammatical mistakes in the reply that it was copied and pasted from somewhere else. Although it's a canned response, it is not (in my view) irrelevant to the matter. The reply is consistent with the JED terms of service policy; it is neither favourable to the OP nor is it favourable to the person whose listing was reported. It's neutral.

The JED took action (which, of itself, disproves the "futility" of using the reporting mechanism). The reporting mechanism worked on that occasion and resulted in a reply that notified the OP of what action had been taken. Whether that action satisfies the OP is another question but the JED responded in a way that was consistent with the terms of service. The OP is free to pursue the matter (outside the forum) if he wishes.

At the risk of repeating myself, it's the responsibility of the users of the JED to engage with developers where they can and, if they cannot engage with the people who submit their extensions to the JED then they may ask the JED team to review such irregularities if people feel that these matters are of critical importance. The reporting mechanism is not necessarily an exercise in futility; the JED team members deal with hundreds of reports every day and they probably feel that the lack of appreciation for what they do also generates a similar sense of "futility" in having to repeat the same message over and over again. As for the characterisation of JED team members as "fools" who write "twaddle", let's give the JED team members a bit of a break, too! ;)

For the most part, the JED is a good guide ... but that's all it is: a guide. There are no absolute truths here; there are only the truths we make.
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Webdongle
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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by Webdongle » Fri Jul 03, 2020 8:38 pm

sozzled wrote:
Fri Jul 03, 2020 7:44 pm
... I know that this is a cause of @Webdongle's frustration with the JED system ...
My comment was nothing to do with frustration. It was a statement of fact.
http://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/
https://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/updating-joomla.html
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results": Albert Einstein.

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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by sozzled » Fri Jul 03, 2020 8:39 pm

There are no indisputable statements of fact here. You have made two claims; I believe the sincerity of those claims but I cannot necessarily accept their factuality without first-hand knowledge of them. Those two claims were:

1) You reported an extension; and
2) You received a reply.

I inferred from first post in this discussion that you were unhappy with the reply you received (e.g. the use of words like "fool", "twaddle", "irrelevant garbage", etc.). I concluded from your second post in this discussion that you felt frustrated with the reporting mechanism. I expressed my sympathy for your frustration. If I drew the wrong conclusions in my last reply here then I apologise.
https://www.kuneze.com/blog
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Webdongle
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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by Webdongle » Fri Jul 03, 2020 11:09 pm

No frustration. I reported a broken link and the reply was twaddle because it bore no relation to the report. The reply was worded like a bulk statement.
http://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/
https://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/updating-joomla.html
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results": Albert Einstein.

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sozzled
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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by sozzled » Sat Jul 04, 2020 1:15 am

I assume that you are interested in purchasing an extension listed on the JED, yes? I assume that you wish to contact the extension developer for the purposes of obtaining that extension and that because the contact links in the JED are "broken" you have been frustrated in making contact with the developer, yes?
https://www.kuneze.com/blog
“If you think I’m wrong then say, ‘I think you’re wrong.’ If you say ‘You’re wrong!’, how do you know?” :)

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Webdongle
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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by Webdongle » Sat Jul 04, 2020 8:05 am

Now you are being silly. It has nothing to do with whether or not it is bought or free. It has nothing to do with me contacting the developer. It is to do with the time wasted because if I look for a suitable app I read all the description and reviews. So if apps are not downloadable then time researching that app is wasted.
http://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/
https://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/updating-joomla.html
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results": Albert Einstein.

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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by sozzled » Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:17 am

Actually, your reply says much about your motivation for this public excoriation of the JED team. I think you would have benefited if you had taken my initial advice and kept your cool. If your motives for reporting an extension [for having "broken links"] were only because you needed to download that extension then I could understand why you're upset. I wonder if those were your only motives for reporting an extension for any irregularities you encountered. I'm sorry for you that you wasted your time.

I strongly believe that the JED team members have done nothing wrong.

I do not believe I have acted in any way that was not respectful towards you or towards the JED team members.

I object to characterisations about the JED team members being "fools" who write "twaddle", "bulk statements", "irrelevant garbage". (I'm also not to keen being silly called for asking a perfectly reasonable question but I can live with that!)

There are ways to contact extension developers. The JED team members can do this. What's stopping anyone else? I really cannot understand why people get all uppity, get out the flame-thrower and vent their frustrations in a public forum.

Thank you to the JED team for acting honestly and impartially. I'm sorry that your lives are made less easy because of complaints from frustrated users of the JED.
https://www.kuneze.com/blog
“If you think I’m wrong then say, ‘I think you’re wrong.’ If you say ‘You’re wrong!’, how do you know?” :)

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Webdongle
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Re: Reporting an extension is futile

Post by Webdongle » Sat Jul 04, 2020 1:43 pm

sozzled wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 9:17 am
...
There are ways to contact extension developers. The JED team members can do this. What's stopping anyone else? ...
The fact that the links are broken. If only the download link is broken I use the other links to get to the developers site and let them know. But when all the links are broken I have no way to contact the developer. Your continual assertion that I am upset does not detract from hat I said.

Anyway the reply I got was almost like it was automated. Nevertheless, it is important to many that broken links are identified.
http://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/
https://www.weblinksonline.co.uk/updating-joomla.html
"The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results": Albert Einstein.

 

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