Terminology for Users

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yerg
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Terminology for Users

Post by yerg » Wed Dec 28, 2005 12:16 am

In Chapter 10: Managing Users and other areas the term Public Back End is used

Public Front-end
| ---- Registered
| -------- Author
| ------------- Editor
| ------------------- Publisher

Public Back-end
| ------- Manager
| ------------- Administrator
| ------------------- Super Administrator

This is actually not the case as the Public do not have access to the back end at all.

Would it not be more correct to use Administration Back-end as the term?
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by charlwillia6 » Wed Dec 28, 2005 1:34 pm

Thanks Yerg,

That does make more sense.  I will suggest it to Michelle.
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by visionspin » Wed Jan 04, 2006 11:12 pm

I agree...that has always been confusing to me as well.

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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Michelle Bisson » Thu Jan 05, 2006 5:28 am

Corrected with:

Administrator Backend
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by pikepace » Thu Jan 05, 2006 6:46 am

If changing this major term is still a possibility, then may I suggest "Public Side" and "Administrator Side"?

The reference to a Public Front-end implies that there is such a thing as a public back-end.  In most of my posts and other discussions regarding Joomla (and mambo previously) I use the "side" terminology.  There are two sides of Joomla, that which anyone can see when they browse to the homepage, and that which only the administrators see when they browse to homepage.com/administrator.

This is not intended to come across as nit-picking.

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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Michelle Bisson » Fri Jan 06, 2006 5:14 am

pikepace,

Thanks for your comments!  If you have interest in helping out the doc team in a more active way, feel free to contact me. 
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by charlwillia6 » Fri Jan 06, 2006 5:41 am

Michelle,

I noticed that some of the ACL components use 'Public Backend' as a term in their configurations?  Do you know if public backend is used by Joomla in the code somewhere, or did this developer add this himself?  This is the JACLPlus configuration that is built off the Joomla ACL permissions.  But I don't know if it is pulling this from the Joomla ACL or if it added this term itself to the component. 

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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Michelle Bisson » Fri Jan 06, 2006 5:46 am

I'll get some imput from the Dev doc team as we need to have harmony in our terminology.
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Chris Davenport » Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:54 am

Hi,

There are 5 references to "Public Backend" in the 1.0.6 code:
chrisd@palladium:~/joomla-svn/branches/1.0$ grep -R '[Pp]ublic [Bb]ackend' *
administrator/components/com_users/admin.users.html.php:                                alert( "Please Select another group as `Public Backend` is not a selectable option" );
administrator/components/com_users/admin.users.php:            } else if ( $filter_type == 'Public Backend' ) {
administrator/components/com_messages/admin.messages.php:      $gid    = $acl->get_group_id( 'Public Backend', 'ARO' );
includes/joomla.php:                            $acl->is_group_child_of( $grp->name, 'Public Backend', 'ARO' )) {
installation/sql/joomla.sql:INSERT INTO `#__core_acl_aro_groups` VALUES (30,28,'Public Backend',13,20);
Regards,
Chris.

Edit: 1.0.x tracker artefact: http://forge.joomla.org/sf/go/artf2919?nav=1
Last edited by Chris Davenport on Fri Jan 06, 2006 11:02 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Chris Davenport » Fri Jan 06, 2006 11:06 am

And in the 1.1 code we have...
chrisd@palladium:~/joomla-svn/trunk$ grep -r '[Pp]ublic [Bb]ackend' *
administrator/language/eng_GB/eng_GB.com_users.ini:PUBLIC BACKEND=Public Backend
administrator/language/eng_GB/eng_GB.com_users.ini:WARNSELECTPB=Please Select another group as `Public Backend` is not a selectable option
administrator/language/eng_GB/eng_GB.com_massmail.ini:PUBLIC BACKEND=Public Backend
administrator/components/com_users/admin.users.php:            } else if ( $filter_type == 'Public Backend' ) {
administrator/components/com_messages/admin.messages.php:      $gid    = $acl->get_group_id( 'Public Backend', '', 'ARO' );installation/installation/sql/joomla.sql:INSERT INTO `#__core_acl_aro_groups` VALUES (30,28,'Public Backend',13,20,'Public Backend');
installation/sql/joomla_backward.sql:INSERT INTO `#__core_acl_aro_groups` VALUES (30,28,'Public Backend',13,20,'Public Backend');
libraries/joomla/auth.php:                                      if ($acl->is_group_child_of($grp->name, 'Registered', 'ARO') || $acl->is_group_child_of($grp->name, 'Public Backend', 'ARO')) {
Regards,
Chris.

Edit: 1.1 tracker artefact: http://forge.joomla.org/sf/go/artf2920?nav=1
Last edited by Chris Davenport on Fri Jan 06, 2006 11:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by charlwillia6 » Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:36 pm

So does that mean that we should leave it in the docs since it is in the code?
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Chris Davenport » Fri Jan 06, 2006 2:05 pm

No, I think both should be changed.

Regards,
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Jinx » Fri Jan 06, 2006 4:00 pm

Hi All,

I suggest to use the terms 'Site' and 'Aministrator' for 1.1. These are also the terms we are using on a code level. Reason for this is that with the new J! Application Framework a default distribution is made up out of 3 applications : the installation, the administrator and the actual site.

One can argue that they are all sites and technically they are we only trying to move away from it from a users perspective. The installation and the administrator are becoming what are called RIA's (rich internet applications). Our goal is to make them act and feel like GUI's. The site well this is the actual site.

This naming change allows allows to easily extend the ACL in the future to include other applications that might become part of a more advanced distribution.

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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by stingrey » Fri Jan 06, 2006 5:01 pm

While I agree the terminolgy change suggested is for the best and is far more logical, this is not technically a bug.

Further this seemingly simply change may cause all sort of compatability problems, something that we stray away from in Stability work.
Such a change can have unforseen consequences for 3rd party addons.  It is the primary objective of the Stability Team to ensure full compatability between stability releases. 



Such a change is something for Development build, and beyond the operational parameters of Stability work, hence is something for 1.1.x

Because of this the bug report in the 1.0.x Tracker has been closed.
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Chris Davenport » Fri Jan 06, 2006 5:50 pm

Thanks Rey, that makes sense.

There seems little point in making the change in 1.0.x.  So the question is should 1.1 be changed and if so to what?

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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by visionspin » Tue Jan 10, 2006 3:39 pm

I am a bit confused as to what to put for the terminology for the documentation. I have read through these posts and it seems that there is not an agreement as to what the terms should be listed as, and it really needs to be determined and then consistently used. I think that it is crucial that we don't cause bugs by using different terms in the various documentations and in the code.

I like Johan's suggestion for "Site" and "Administrator" to be the terms we use for 1.1, but then am concerned about what Rey is saying regarding the compatibility and stability issues. Have we reached any resolution on this for 1.1?

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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Jinx » Tue Jan 10, 2006 4:24 pm

As Rey explains the terminology changes can't be done in a stability release only in a minor release. If you agree on using my suggestion then we have a resolution indeed.
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Michelle Bisson » Wed Jan 11, 2006 1:29 am

Jinx,

This makes sense for versions 1.1x.
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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Jinx » Mon Jan 30, 2006 2:44 pm

Hi All,

I just wanted to check if we have an agreement on the naming change, before making the actual changes. Meaning Site and Administrator ?

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Re: Terminology for Users

Post by Michelle Bisson » Thu Feb 02, 2006 4:13 am

Jinx,

Please read for details : http://forum.joomla.org/index.php/topic,28337.0.html

Thanks!
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