When a "ad" is not a "ad". Topic is solved

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TheINIC
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When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by TheINIC » Sun Jan 17, 2021 9:28 pm

I know - it's long, but has to be said and no one is forcing anyone to read it.

I just came across this here at Joomla.Org:

"We have detected that you are using an ad blocker. The Joomla! Project relies on revenue from these advertisements so please consider disabling the ad blocker for this domain." <--- NOTE: This GUI refused to display this in red, bold, underline, italic, or quoted. Preview shows it, then deletes it. Censor board?

Let's stop right there. First, I do NOT block ads. I block SMIRCers. If any "SMIRC" is disguised as a ad, then yes, SMIRCer gets blocked.

::: This part is NOT directed at Joomla :::
There are ads wrapped around stalkers. There are ads that drop permanent cookies, pixels, use beacons, cross-site invasion, and the list goes on of the ways and means SMIRCers continue to find ways to circumvent our rights to privacy.

Stalk, Monitor, Inject, Record, Control

It's not news that "Google trackers lurk on 75% of the top million websites" (according to DuckDuck) most search engines and catalogues like Google use every means available to SMIRC.

Most web sites administrators have no idea that the template they are colouring in, is riddled with SMIRCware. That, and almost every site has their hand out reaching for tidbits of our privacy to sell to the giants and marketeers.

Let me put it this way:
Dear Web Master,
When I visit your 'house', you have every right to follow me around, watch what I see, type, mouse-over, and for how long, and from what my location is while using what devices.
But when I arrive, you have no right to strip-search my devices to see where I have been, what I saw, typed, and for how long, from what location using what devices. Just because in unprotected country's like Canad and the U.S. has no laws against Internet SMIRCers, doesn't mean it's right to SMIRC.

Likewise, when I leave your house, you have no right to hide dozens of gum-shoes on me that will report back, and to other sites, where I have been, for how long, using what devices from what location.

All that just to "enhance" my experience at their site! Oh and I am informed by gobbledygook in that legalezed blathering that I agree to their pimping out my rights to privacy.

For many, there is no alternative BUT to agree to the Philadelphia lawyers ...party of the first part shall give up all rights to privacy...

It's why the GRDP came about. Because sites won't protect visitors, so the government had to step in and do the right thing.

There are those that extort our agreeing to be SMIRCed... agree or get lost. Times are changing, and fast, as more people opt to protect their right to privacy.

Companies feeling the pressure add a 'Opt out' option. That in itself is usually a long run down the rabbit hole in futility. Googles own opt out fails miserably.

Web Master, Administrator, System Operator, Site Designer - whatever your moniker... take heed. More and more sites are being built without dark alleyways hiding peeps and perves heck-bent on pimping out our rights to privacy for a few pieces of silver.

I have found Joomla is the easiest to learn, use, and control. Those using Joomla for their web sites should consider visitors rights when putting the sites together. Joomla makes it easy.

If web sites in America and Canada don't start some decent self policing, and won't make it easy to opt out, then sooner or later, the government will tell (order) you how you will respect visitors rights. We don't need any more government controls. Please don't be part of the reason the feds step in and mandate more laws.

::: Now, directed to Joomla :::
Dear Joomla,

I do appreciate your note informing me that I block SMIRCers (you call them ads), but I am not going to apologize for preventing further erosion to my rights to privacy. I DO ALLOW "ADS". I do NOT block ADS. I DO block anything that peeps at my history, peels open my devices CPU, APU, GPU, MoBo individual MAC addresses, Location, History, snap-shots of my Font system, screen and audio, unique browser ID, and so on.

Perhaps the warning that I am blocking ads needs a closer look so it can better define the difference between an "ad" and a SMIRCer. Ads are just a image with some text and are easy to get a passing grade as being SMIRC-free.

From my experience, Joomla has a great reputation and pretty good support. Please continue the great work but now that you're well established, how about making it easier for us to see ads, not SMIRCers.

Thank you,

~i~

p.s. I have uBlock running, but it's disabled here.
Last edited by toivo on Sun Jan 17, 2021 10:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: mod note: moved from 3.x General Questions
S.M.I.R.C. = Stalk, Monitor, Inject, Record, Control and A.I. = Artificial Idiot ◄

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Re: When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by pe7er » Mon Jan 18, 2021 2:54 pm

I am aware that websites can track you without using cookies, but on instead profiling visitors on their hardware/software. See https://coveryourtracks.eff.org/

However, I have not heard of the term "SMIRC" before.
What does it stand for?
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Re: When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by sozzled » Mon Jan 18, 2021 6:49 pm

@pe7er: SMIRC
TheINIC wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 9:28 pm
Stalk, Monitor, Inject, Record, Control
https://www.kuneze.com/blog
“If you think I’m wrong then say, ‘I think you’re wrong.’ If you say ‘You’re wrong!’, how do you know?” :)

TheINIC
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Re: When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by TheINIC » Mon Jan 18, 2021 8:34 pm

pe7er wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 2:54 pm
I am aware that websites can track you without using cookies, but on instead profiling visitors on their hardware/software. See https://coveryourtracks.eff.org/

However, I have not heard of the term "SMIRC" before.
What does it stand for?
@sozzled got it right. Tell your boss @sozzled that I said you may have next week off with full pay. :)

Cookies???? There are dozens of other ways that nefarious ne'er-do-wells will ignore our rights to privacy. There are also thousands of web sites plagiarizing each other in how to cover one's tracks. Some tracks can be covered, but not all of them.

Google, Microsoft, and we won't go into the biggest rapists of privacy, are fighting back. I am NOT blocking ads in the forum. If I did, then the site breaks for me and I get the 1990 blue links (which should be law) and a old style menu from the same period. So, in exchange for seeking help, I must give up and bare some, never all :)

Yes, there are many ways to try to protect your rights, but some tools will break your view of the sites, slow down your Internet to a crawl, and rape your privacy for themselves. Check every one out - read reviews and not reviews on a site that sells what they review. Thank you @pe7erfor for the link, but anti-SMIRC are my business.

There is one company building privacy oriented devices I've been monitoring that have no GPU, APU etcetera MACs. I hope it's OK to mention them here without getting spanked or exiled; they are Librem products. Laptops and Phones running their own Linux based OS. They also provide a replaceable battery so we don't toss out our phones because the battery is job security at ''those other phones'' homes.

The biggest and most important commodity on the Internet today is you. Your right to privacy is pimped out to marketeers and government.

But, I digress. The Giant Peeps and Pervs - you know who they are, have forced Mum & Pop style sites to unknowingly (in most cases) become the Giants minions. We tested 10 random web site templates. Every one had embedded SMIRCers. Some worse than others. Some had template authors receiving data back on customers visitors.

Darn - digressed again.

Point is, right now I'm blocking 14 trackers, cookies, followers and "other tools to make" my browsing more pleasurable. I am NOT using a "ad blocker" as alleged by the Joomla page that warned me. If the ad is a picture, text or both AND has "other tools", and can follow and report, then that is a Stalker and that so-called "ad" gets blocked - for my protection as well as for the site because the information gathered by following me would be wrong. I see to that.

I am the one that reads the Terms of Use and Privacy Policy. I read every 'policy' where I sign up. The more convoluted and confusing the policy is, the less I trust the site, and will move on. But, some places don't even realize they are eroding our rights to privacy.

This was/is about a Joomla page (here) that misread my browser's intention. My intention is to allow all the glitzy, bling, kiddie-kewl, blazoned in-my-face ads - but won't if it has a embedded stalker.

I want to see Joomla succeed. I hope they make enough in ad revenue to continue growing and return to it's top place in the CMS arena. If they make enough through ad revenue, and don't get the greed bug, then Joomla won't be forced to start looking to us for it's income i.e. Rent a CMS like we often do with plugins and add-ons. It's a two way street. Should never become a dark alleyway of peeps and perves stalking us, monitoring what we do, injecting more stalkers, recording what we do, and using that to control what we see on the Internet.

Careful what you ask me - I might answer :D
~i~
S.M.I.R.C. = Stalk, Monitor, Inject, Record, Control and A.I. = Artificial Idiot ◄

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Re: When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by pe7er » Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:11 am

sozzled wrote:
Mon Jan 18, 2021 6:49 pm
@pe7er: SMIRC
TheINIC wrote:
Sun Jan 17, 2021 9:28 pm
Stalk, Monitor, Inject, Record, Control
ah, thanks for the clarification! I didn't see that.
With a search on duckduckgo.com I only found other uses like "Summer MI Rope Conference", "Stanford Microwave Integrated Circuits Laboratory", "Southern Miss Institutional Repository Conference", etc. :-)
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Re: When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by ooffick » Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:58 am

Ok, thanks for all the info. So you would like to see us remove the popup "which asked users to disable any ad blocker" or use a different ad supplier or what else could we do to stop this?

I am genuinely interested in any ideas to run ads without SMIRC, is this possible via Google Ads?

Kind regards
Olaf
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Re: When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by TheINIC » Tue Jan 19, 2021 10:23 pm

ooffick wrote:
Tue Jan 19, 2021 8:58 am
Ok, thanks for all the info. So you would like to see us remove the popup "which asked users to disable any ad blocker" or use a different ad supplier or what else could we do to stop this?

I am genuinely interested in any ideas to run ads without SMIRC, is this possible via Google Ads?

Kind regards
Olaf
DARN! I just finished brief detailed reply, and it made me login AGAIN, and reply was gone.

OK. No, I am not advocating removing the banner. I don't see where that was implied.

I think it unfair to state that we ARE blocking ads when we are not. It's all in When a "ad" is not a "ad".
I, block ads that are hiding stalkers. It's not Joomla doing this. It's the ad purveyors, it's the tools sites use that stalk in order to SMIRC.

Some sites refuse access if a ad blocker is detected. Again, they fail to realize that ads are not the issue, it's the purveyor of the ads, 3rd party website services, and some of the bells and some whistles to make a site kewl, that are the culprits.
The ad is one form of revenue for Google, pimping our privacy is the other, and more important revenue for them.

The best way to see my point of view is a quote from the movie Anon where "the Girl" says "It's not that I have something to hide. I have nothing I want you to see."

Keep the banner, but please realize that it's not fair to point the finger at the visitor who is not blocking the ads, they are protecting their right to privacy, or trying to.

If I were to read 'into' the banner, it might mean 'Please disable all rights to your privacy.'

I think a safe ad supplier depends on how you place ads and what kind. Too bad you can't set up a small ad-shopping cart where companies log in, place a JPG and text as a ad, and pay Joomla directly, avoiding the shysters and scamps. I think there is a add-on for that :)

Google offers personalized directed ads, based on your visitors Google profile (we all have one), verses you having to decide what ads to run. When I land here, I might see a ad for wine because I just came from a site that sells wine, while someone else having looked at a new car lineup, gets a ad with a new car. It's a winning way, but I don't like being collateral damage.

~i~
S.M.I.R.C. = Stalk, Monitor, Inject, Record, Control and A.I. = Artificial Idiot ◄

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Re: When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by ooffick » Wed Jan 20, 2021 8:54 am

Yes, we had a setup before were we tried to run this all ourself. The problem with this was that performance was a huge issue and it turned out to be unusable.

So unfortunately, i don't see any settings we can set in Google Ads to disable this behavior.

On the other hand we do not disable the forum even if you do have a ad blocker installed.

Kind regards
Olaf
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Re: When a "ad" is not a "ad".

Post by TheINIC » Thu Jan 21, 2021 10:43 pm

ooffick wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 8:54 am
....
So unfortunately, i don't see any settings we can set in Google Ads to disable this behavior.
I know - - - Google is in charge.

ooffick wrote:
Wed Jan 20, 2021 8:54 am
On the other hand we do not disable the forum even if you do have a ad blocker installed.
Joomla might not disable the page, Google does... that 3rd party no one is responsible for. Just to read this page, I have to allow 16 SMIRCers.

That said, I do allow ads, but not any with embedded stalkers. So I see zero ads here. Lose the stalker, I'll see the ads. But as the topic says, when a ad is not a ad, I don't see it. So I don't see how Joomla can make money from selling my information or anyone that is using a SMIRC_blocker.

I hope someone comes up with a way to disinfect ads so they ARE just ads because I don't mind a binary bit-byter telling me what is best for me based on my profile if it will help web sites stay alive.

Good luck
~i~
S.M.I.R.C. = Stalk, Monitor, Inject, Record, Control and A.I. = Artificial Idiot ◄


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