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Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Sun Sep 20, 2015 10:24 pm
by MarijkeS
Forum thread to discuss the blog post "Introducing the Transition Team"
http://community.joomla.org/blogs/leade ... -team.html

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 3:53 pm
by leolam
Why am I not surprised that a Manager of Redcomponent is 'selected' to this team?

Leo 8)

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 4:28 pm
by HlnMoore
Thank you for sharing can we contact them at all ?

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Mon Sep 21, 2015 5:05 pm
by 219jondn

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:45 am
by montano
Ian McMillan: "He has no history as a Joomla community member"
One single solitary woman chosen.

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:06 am
by leolam
montano wrote:Ian McMillan: "He has no history as a Joomla community member"
Funny that somebody with no Joomla history is chosen (?) into a transition team Where does he suddenly pops-up from? Very remarkable. Can somebody with knowledge explain his sudden arrival on the scene?

Leo 8)

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 12:38 pm
by tresan
You may or may not agree with us.

But we, as the leadership of Joomla (CLT + PLT + the board) have collectively voted in the above Transition Members.

Each leadership member voted on their own as per their own consciousness and on the candidates they think will perform the job at hand in the best way.

All of the Transition Team members was voted in with major majority by the leadership members and we fully support and stand behind the election of these Transition Team members.

Its ok if you dont agree - and then you can tell us you dont agree - but please respect the Transition Team members.

They are volunteers in our community and deserve respect for standing up and offering their time and ressources to help our community in this transition.

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 12:40 pm
by wilsonge
He's a family member of someone actively involved in the UK Joomla community. His day to day job is in doing these kinds of transitions. Personally I voted for him (I can't speak for the rest of leadership) as there is distrust between the leadership teams at the moment and it gives a useful external view on the proceedings.

Kind Regards,
George

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 2:29 pm
by JacquesR
Good luck to all who were elected to this important team! :)
It looks like a good mix of people.

Jacques

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 2:51 pm
by leolam
@ Ronny, those vague general (slightly insulting) statements do not work for me. I never stated I do not agree nor disrespect..... Don't put words in my mouth please and mind how you reply therefor? Nevertheless of course you made sure you have eyes in the team...Well staged! (and yes that was on same level as you addressing me)

I just asked (and as a long term member of this community I am allowed to ask I believe unless this is already considered a sin of death like often when things are questioned with OSM) for a clarification how it is possible that somebody is elected into a Transition Team who has never set food 'on our floor' so to say? Is it too much asked to extend the clarification beyond "he has not been involved but is a change management expert"? (so am I btw IRL amongst others and?.....)

I am happy for the team with the expertise he is bringing seemingly and hopefully for Joomla if somebody with some real 'volume' can enhance the challenges this team is facing, especially with the current state of trust among Leadership Teams but I still am curious why he suddenly pops-up.... He has never been a volunteer (as you claim) So clarification is all I asked and still ask.

@ George..... I learned about his background online and his day-job and experience which can be very valuable hopefully and I appreciate your honest reply expressing what I already knew though from other exchanges with real people. Nice to see you allow yourself to express the real status among teams at present.

Hope he is not being cut in pieces like others by 'the mobs'. (they know who they are)

Wish the Team all the strength btw....--> they will need it!

Cheers

Leo Lammerink
MD GWS Global Web Services Ltd

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 3:40 pm
by leolam
BTW just a little side step but does the "Leadership" is aware that the internal-structure "in-fights" are taking us a tremendous 16% loss of market share in one year! That is huge! Cannot we better spend our energy on creating a better Joomla! ?

Source: http://w3techs.com/technologies/history ... management

Leo 8)

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 3:42 pm
by 219jondn
Leo, I'm confused at what you still need answered?

You yourself noted the value someone from the outside (and specifically this team member, according the the research you yourself did) brings. You have also been informed as to how he came to be nominated to the team - through a connection from an active UK community member. So can you please clarify what you'd still like answered? Because you seem to have answered all your questions already, but you still keep asking them.

If you could help us by clarifying what exactly you need answered that hasn't already been answered, I'm sure someone from the Structure or Transition team can attempt to answer those for you :)

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 3:51 pm
by leolam
Jon with all respect I have not been informed why this person has been nominated since I had no idea who he was before selected. So simply stated why was he nominated by who with what reason/agenda since he has no previous Joomla involvement. Must be a bloody good reason and good discussions for this and I simply want to know where he comes from (and you know darn well what this question means so do not play the fool!) Why ws this person pushed to become a Transition Team Member with no Joomla experience? Have you seen answers to that? Me not!

Next time I nominate my niece who likes to play with my old Nintendo (Also family relation) See the crap answer?

Thanks Jon

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:03 pm
by 219jondn
thanks for your clarification, Leo.

I'd like to request that this thread be kept respectful. From my understanding of your questions, they had already been answered - your clarification shows that they're not - but nobody is playing the fool here, I've been respectful in my responses to you, I'd kindly ask the same.

To answer your question - and maybe someone from the structure team could add more context to this - I don't think there was a "push" to add any specific member. Everyone was free to nominate whoever they wanted. Ian was nominated, for the skill set that was already noted. The combined leadership (24 people who voted) obviously saw the value in that skill set, and voted for him.

As you've already noted yourself, someone from outside our community, with experience in transitions, brings a valuable perspective. I can confirm just from the short time the transition team members have been communicating, he's already contributed a great deal to the team, and I'm very glad he's a part of the team.

Hopefully that helps clarify.

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:26 pm
by leolam
219jondn wrote:I'd like to request that this thread be kept respectful. From my understanding of your questions, they had already been answered - your clarification shows that they're not - but nobody is playing the fool here, I've been respectful in my responses to you, I'd kindly ask the same.
I have never been disrespectful so don't play that ball please. You are making insinuations I do not appreciate nor are they justified? I have not shown any disrespect at any of my posts so cut the crap will you?
Ian was nominated, for the skill set that was already noted. The combined leadership (24 people who voted) obviously saw the value in that skill set, and voted for him.
You still have not answered where somebody who has no Joomla record at all (which does not has to be bad for sure) is suddenly promoted into a prominent role. I know he has been selected and I am fine with that (love democratic processes) so do not play the dombo here? The question was clearly explained and I repeat where he comes from with what agenda and pushed to the front of Joomla by who? What is not clear about that question?

Leo 8)

Edit: Why MR. Ian McMillan is not simply introducing himself and outlining his perceptions and planned contributions to our beloved Joomla-project? If he is that important it would be not more than descent to introduce himself to this community? (Not respectful question Jon?)

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:36 pm
by Datatonic
Just to clear this up.

Ian Moncrieff MacMillan is my half brother. I was the one who nominated him.

I nominated him because his career has been spent handling high level change management programs for some of the largest institutions on the planet. I felt that this team needed someone with this high level of expertise in bringing about change.

The fact that he is not from the community given the task at hand, to me is a bonus.

Ian knows other members of the Joomla! community from his time as a BlackStar with ecademy and has met other members of the community through me. He has watched me carve a career from Joomla!, make friends in and become part of the community. He understands the passion that being part of it can bring out in people.

My nomination was not nepotism, it was simply because I knew he had some free time and his skill set fits the task.

As for him being torn to bits, I wouldn't worry about him, he's got a tough skin and is used to a level of animosity from co-workers in these situations.

Hope this clears things up.

Thanks.

Rowan Hoskyns Abrahall

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:37 pm
by pe7er
leolam wrote:Why am I not surprised that a Manager of Redcomponent is 'selected' to this team?
Please keep on topic and do not make such insinuations.
leolam wrote:I have never been disrespectful so don't play that ball please. You are making insinuations I do not appreciate nor are they justified? I have not shown any disrespect at any of my posts so cut the crap will you?
Please be constructive and stop with the passive aggressive attitude that I read in your posts in this topic.
Thank you in advance!

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:52 pm
by leolam
@ Pe7er: You read wrong but what is new if you do not want to read what is stated actually? As often the 'constructive' criticism or any form of discussion is being killed the moment the "Leadership" is offended or criticized. Does your reaction to my post reflects the Joomla Leadership thoughts or is it a personal reply for which I would feel very offended?

I am fairly allowed to express my (descent formulated) concerns and (well formulated and well behaved) thoughts on a Joomla Open Source Forum without being continuously moderated by Global Moderators who are also Members of the same Leadership (in good Dutch "vestzak -- broekzak Peter!)

I have no respect for Leadership Members who (as Moderators of this forum in such function) try to or initiate steps (!) to silence a prominent forum member from criticizing "Leadership" decisions. That Peter is not democratic nor in line with the Joomla Open Source concept and world. ( I did not break any forum rules!)

What do you read in
Why am I not surprised that a Manager of Redcomponent is 'selected' to this team?
and feel offended? What is wrong with that and against the forum rules? You do mind explaining why you feel this offensive?

Once again I have deep respect for all what is done but I am allowed to ask questions do I?

Best regards,
Leo

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 4:54 pm
by hagen
My best and truly wishes are coming from the bottom of my heart to the transition team.
Go and do your best!

Hagen :pop ;)

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:30 pm
by MarijkeS
The Transition Team nomination and election process was voted upon by the entire leadership and was shared with the community:
http://community.joomla.org/blogs/leade ... -team.html
As you can read in that blogpost, the procedure for the nomination and election process was adopted with 23 votes cast, and all were in favor.

The structure team combined all the information that was shared about the nominees, including a self written motivation of the candidate and confirmation of all. No nominee was left out of the candidate pool that the Leadership could chose from. The way information was shared internally was publicly announced here http://volunteers.joomla.org/reports/11 ... ng-minutes including the email that was sent to the leadership members internal mailing list, as well as a notification that voting started https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic ... JL_UHFSD1k

I haven't seen any complaints by the leadership members about the way information was shared about the candidates. On the contrary, a number of them complimented the team in the way all of the information available was shared. Voting was private, there was no way any LT member could influence the results of the elections. Along with me, two community members were involved in verifying the election process followed all the rules set.

As there are already several answers about how someone who wasn't part of the community so far was nominated, I think that question is answered. It was up to the electorate to vote as they pleased, and with 24 (out of 27) LT members who did so, it seems clear to me that the majority put more weight on the expertise of the candidate rather than not being involved in the community or on gender (just to address another concern).

Personally I have put a lot of work into the whole process. Of course every process can be better, but I've done the best I can together with the structure team. To me the result looks like a very good mix, even though it wasn't exactly what I voted personally, but that doesn't matter to me. I do have trust in this team of people that consists of only people who want to see the project moving the best way forward, I don't have any doubts about that.

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:34 pm
by pe7er
leolam wrote:@ Pe7er: You read wrong but what is new if you do not want to read what is stated actually?

Here you are doing it again. Please stop with your passive aggressive tone of voice.
leolam wrote:As usual the 'constructive' criticism or any form of discussion is being killed the moment the "Leadership" is offended or criticized. Does your reaction to my post reflects the Joomla Leadership thoughts or is it a personal reply for which I would feel very offended?
I have no idea if my reaction reflects the Joomla Leadership thoughts. I am not a mind reader.

I am part of the Global Moderator team at Joomla forum and I want the forum to be a friendly place where people can find technical help and/or have constructive discussions. Constructive criticism is welcome. A passive aggressive attitude is not constructive as it will silence community members who might be afraid that will be attacked verbally.
leolam wrote:I am fairly allowed to express my (descent formulated) concerns and (well formulated and well behaved) thoughts on a Joomla Open Source Forum without being continuously moderated by Global Moderators who are also Members of the same Leadership (in good Dutch "vestzak -- broekzak Peter!)

I am not a member of the Leadership team. I have been active in the Community Leadership Team (CLT) in the past.

I know the meaning of the Dutch saying "vestzak - broekzak" which is used to critisize a shift in spending from one budget to another. I don't understand what you imply with that saying.
leolam wrote:I have no respect for Leadership Members who (as Moderators of this forum in such function) try to or initiate steps (!) to silence a prominent forum member from criticizing "Leadership" decisions. That Peter is not democratic nor in line with the Joomla Open Source concept and world. ( I did not break any forum rules!)
I am not trying to silence you. I just asked you to be constructive and stop with your passive aggressive tone of voice.

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 5:44 pm
by leolam
MarijkeS wrote:As there are already several answers about how someone who wasn't part of the community so far was nominated, I think that question is answered.
Thanks Marijke for the extensive clarification and rest assured that it is highly appreciated! I do not agree thought that answers have been given to my questions but it seems that I am on the fringe of being suspended by certain Global Mods I will have to rest my case and stop debating this. I am simply silenced because I comment......

How said since "trying" even to continue an open minded discussion is not possible with this Global Mod. (tears) Just see replies.....Any comments are being threatened with Board suspension...How democratic . @ Pe7er: You do try to silence me since you do not like my comments. That is your problem and not mine and you make them into Board violations which is ridiculous!!

Your "passive aggressive tone of voice" assumption/judgement is something others have to judge about..... Your assumption is (for me) plain wrong. It is "an Opinion expressed by you" I never intended to be "aggressive". Your emotional assumption decides the interpretation which is solidly yours and never my intention.

Leo

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 6:25 pm
by Jenny
Would it be possible to be informed as to who the other 3 nominees were that were not selected in the voting process?

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 6:27 pm
by Webdongle
219jondn wrote:...
I'd like to request that this thread be kept respectful. From my understanding of your questions, they had already been answered - your clarification shows that they're not - but nobody is playing the fool here,....
Leo has asked a legitimate question which was not answered fully.

A more fuller explanation was offered by Datatonic on his 18th post to this forum

However 2 comments made does beg some questions as to what is happening
(I can't speak for the rest of leadership) as there is distrust between the leadership teams at the moment and it gives a useful external view on the proceedings.
Datatonic" wrote:As for him being torn to bits, I wouldn't worry about him, he's got a tough skin and is used to a level of animosity from co-workers in these situations
  1. Why is there distrust among the membership ?
  2. Why has someone, previously unknown to the majority of the Joomla community and volunteers, been brought in for his specialised skills of reorganisation ?
  3. Are the two things linked ?
Before I am attacked for my questions let me point out that I have chosen my words so as to be respectful as possible.

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 6:28 pm
by ot2sen
Good luck with the important task at hand to the newly formed Transition Team.

Thanks big time for accepting the challenge and thanks for volunteering your time to make the transition happen in the best interest of the project and its community.

It is good to see the result of the nomination and the final team from the vote made.
Looks like there is a fine composition and balance of heart, skills and devotion.

You can make it happen :)

As always, if you need us (read: the community), just shout and we will do our best to assist.

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 6:38 pm
by leolam
Jenny wrote:Would it be possible to be informed as to who the other 3 nominees were that were not selected in the voting process?
I did not even dare to ask that question for being whacked instantly. Nice call Jenny

Leo 8)

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 7:39 pm
by QBParis
Congratulations, and best of luck to the new Transition Team. And, a HUGE thank you to all of you for volunteering your time, energy and expertise to this very important juncture in Joomla's story. It is very much appreciated by so many!

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 7:41 pm
by jgress-
+1 QBParis

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 8:08 pm
by rdeutz
Just a few comments from someone who is not well know as a big fan of the structure change. :D

I wish the transition team success! I don’t see it as a big job as others do for me it seems a quite easy one. I am hoping that this will be finished soon, it is not healthy for our community that we are stuck in a in-between situation.

I had quite the same reasons as George for voting Ian in, I am hoping with experiences outside of Joomla! and of transition processes like the one we are facing right now it will speed up the process.

We never (at least I can remember) publish information about people who got not voted in so I think this will be not changed now. It doesn’t make any difference anyway.

Re: Introducing the Transition Team

Posted: Tue Sep 22, 2015 8:46 pm
by Jenny
rdeutz wrote: We never (at least I can remember) publish information about people who got not voted in so I think this will be not changed now. It doesn’t make any difference anyway.
I just think that part of the whole reason for the transition is to bring transparency as to how the election process is conducted, so that it isn't all behind closed doors and secretive. That has been one of the biggest complaints in the past.

There is nothing stopping the immediate process from being transparent and open right now. It just appears that people don't want to actually be transparent and open and share the information, they just want to use the words "transparent" and "open" without actually putting the words in action.

It does make a difference. I know lots of people have wondered who was nominated. Also in discussions it was thought to be rather odd that if only 9 candidates in total were nominated and all were qualified to be members of the team, why all 9 were not brought into the fold of the transition team. 3 more people added would only make the transition team more diverse, and would not have created any hardship in terms of unmanageable size.

The rules and guidelines for other parts of this process have changed repeatedly to be able to adapt as the project has changed during this process. Why was this limit of 6 people only a rule that had to be written in stone?

I think the team is a well thought out team. All good qualified people. I just don't see the need for the secrets and behind closed door portions of how this has transpired. Especially in light of the fact that the transition is being done to allow the community to have more information, more involvement, for more of the processes and elections to be out in the open, and to have a more transparent communication and feedback loop.