Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

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drh3rdiii
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Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by drh3rdiii » Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:42 am

Have been searching for the solution to system email from Joomla on a Godaddy shared hosting environment. And called GD and couple of techs said they did not know the answer… Not Joomal related. Just how to enable openssl in a shared hosting environment.

Saw some documentation state openssl needs to be enabled in php for mail to work from the back end. So ok. I search for how to enable openssl in my php.ini file in my root folder. I came at it from command line as well as Cpanel… assuming (yeah, that word), that Cpanel would have a menu selection to enable openssl in the version of PHP (7.4). Nawp. And the tech said he did not understand the question either. He said wait while he Googled. I said naw, I can do that. Long sigh, I know.

So continued searching and saw various approaches, too numerous to mention, on how to enable openssl for Joomla email methods to work. Sendmail, PHP Mail, SMTP mail…. have not been able to enable any of them so far.

Soooo, back here to ask for help on this. Do I need openssl enabled for starters? I thought at least using sendmail would not need this, but my testing fails no matter what. Have followed several directions for Joomla, Joomla and Godaddy… stuck.

Have tested with two SMTP destinations, one being Google/Gmail. For testing purposes just to see it work.

Sooooooo, anyone point me to a HowTo, to crack the mail function from Joomla admin backend, and if GoDaddy fluent, that would be helpful. Or if any HowTos that don’t care about the hosting environment, that would be cool.

Brand spanking new Joomla 3.9.27, PHP 7.4, Apache2. Godaddy shared hosting environment.

tx

drh3rdiii
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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by drh3rdiii » Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:46 am

And starting to see... GoDaddy may be blocking mail from shared hosting servers... that may be the problem, sigh. Anyone have experience, opinion on this?

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sozzled
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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by sozzled » Thu Jun 24, 2021 6:33 am

I'm not familiar with email blocking problems from shared hosting services. These things can be examined if you're prepared to invest your time looking into it. I may be able to point you to areas with your webhost that address the problem. We could do this again via videoconference. Probably best if you have a desktop/laptop environment with Skype (so that you can share your screen with me) rather than by using a mobile phone-based Skype.
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toivo
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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by toivo » Thu Jun 24, 2021 7:24 am

Your host should make SSL available in PHP. That has nothing to do with Joomla.

If your host allows you to use an external mail server, get the settings from the host managing the mail server. For example Google SMTP is available, if your web host allows the website to connect to an external SMTP server, rather than their own mail server:

How do I use Gmail as my mail server

You can get a detailed log of all the messages exchanged between the Joomla site and the SMTP server. Inspect this transaction log and it shows what is going wrong between the two servers at the SMTP protocol level. Then get your IT department, hosting or email provider to resolve any connectivity issues.

Go to Extensions - Plugins and configure the system plugin 'System - Debug' with the following settings:
  • Allowed Groups: Super Users
  • Log Priorities: All
  • Log Categories: mail
  • Log Almost Everything
Go to Global Configuration and turn on the debug option in the System tab - Debug Settings - Debug System.

Go to the Server tab - Mail Settings and click the button Send Test Mail.

The test result, success or failure, will then get displayed as a system message, but you can download the detailed log file 'everything.php' from the Joomla log folder, usually administrator/logs, or, if your site was installed much earlier, from the /logs folder in the main Joomla folder.

The SMTP status codes and error messages are often not self-explanatory. In that case post the relevant lines from the log here for assistance.
Toivo Talikka, Global Moderator

drh3rdiii
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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by drh3rdiii » Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:28 pm

sozzled wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 6:33 am
I'm not familiar with email blocking problems from shared hosting services. These things can be examined if you're prepared to invest your time looking into it. I may be able to point you to areas with your webhost that address the problem. We could do this again via videoconference. Probably best if you have a desktop/laptop environment with Skype (so that you can share your screen with me) rather than by using a mobile phone-based Skype.
Ah... here you are, ready to help again. I thought I'd give you a break by posting public but...

Will post where it is now below. I believe it is now outside Joomla and with hosting. So.. next msg..

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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by drh3rdiii » Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:31 pm

Thank you for this precise info. I did run this a couple of times before zzzzzzs and it did not reveal anything in the error logs.

But, after some changes, am now getting a 'email sent successfully' reported by Joomla. But it never arrives. I believe this is now at the hosting layer and will get back with them. I plan on moving away from them anyway so rather than continue to chase this down, given that I have a 'success' message... sigh... it is just another reason to have me change hosting services.

I have learned more new techniques tho. Again, very much appreciate your detailed post. I now want to figure out why I did not get any errors reporting. Of course I do...

tx

toivo wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 7:24 am
Your host should make SSL available in PHP. That has nothing to do with Joomla.

If your host allows you to use an external mail server, get the settings from the host managing the mail server. For example Google SMTP is available, if your web host allows the website to connect to an external SMTP server, rather than their own mail server:

How do I use Gmail as my mail server

You can get a detailed log of all the messages exchanged between the Joomla site and the SMTP server. Inspect this transaction log and it shows what is going wrong between the two servers at the SMTP protocol level. Then get your IT department, hosting or email provider to resolve any connectivity issues.

Go to Extensions - Plugins and configure the system plugin 'System - Debug' with the following settings:
  • Allowed Groups: Super Users
  • Log Priorities: All
  • Log Categories: mail
  • Log Almost Everything
Go to Global Configuration and turn on the debug option in the System tab - Debug Settings - Debug System.

Go to the Server tab - Mail Settings and click the button Send Test Mail.

The test result, success or failure, will then get displayed as a system message, but you can download the detailed log file 'everything.php' from the Joomla log folder, usually administrator/logs, or, if your site was installed much earlier, from the /logs folder in the main Joomla folder.

The SMTP status codes and error messages are often not self-explanatory. In that case post the relevant lines from the log here for assistance.

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sozzled
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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by sozzled » Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:40 pm

As a general observation, @toivo is partly correct.

On the one hand, how you've organised email services with your webhost is outside J!. On the other hand, J! will use whatever you've organised with your webhost, provided you have configured that service within J! Global Configuration settings and the webhost's email works irrespective of whether J! can use it or not.

If your J! website has problems with sending mail then @toivo has given you a few pointers on how to diagnose those problems. If your email just doesn't work at all then that's what needs to be fixed first.

On the other hand, in view of the fact that you had problems (in another forum discussion) receiving email from this forum, when you wrote:
drh3rdiii wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:31 pm
after some changes, am now getting a 'email sent successfully' reported by Joomla but it never arrives.
this suggests that the email may be dispatched but it's disappearing into the ether (or, perhaps, your email client application is rejecting its reception or putting it into a spam folder). What I sometimes do in these situations is connect to the email "server" using a browser-based webmail client and poke around in there. The problem could be at the server end or it could be at the client end. :pop

I don't know whether SSL is involved; the last time I looked, the website you had problems with did not have a SSL certificate attached to it and, for that reason (possibly) you may have to consider not using SSL-secured email. Regardless of whether SSL is involved—all my domains have valid SSL certificates—I mainly use PHP Mail (the default) with my J! websites.

drh3rdiii wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 5:42 am
Do I need openssl enabled for starters?
I enable this PHP extension on my servers but, by the same token, I use SSL [certificates] anyway. It can't hurt (I guess) to enable this PHP extension in your case.

We could "make some changes"—I don't know what they may be or what you've done—and carry on this discussion on a turn-based discussion forum, or we could cut through difficulties of typing and just talk about it. Back to you.
Last edited by sozzled on Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by drh3rdiii » Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:49 pm

Yessir... believe you have identified some of the key gotchas in this. That I also never received email from you sent from Joomla forums, points me to the mail server function at Gddy.

However, all this has urged me to just moved hosting services sooner rather than later. That has always been my intention anywayzz. Getting mail functionality amongst the 4 retooled Joomla sites that sat for 3+ years, that was about the last function. Of note, significant in all this, is all of the sites are not dynamic. Not interactive. They were interactive until recently. They needed to transition to static legacy sites. No logins. Any updating is from me.

Another factor was a simple call to Gddy support... almost immediately throwing in the towel support-wise. Said they were Wordpre** savvy, and not so Joomla. That influences my stopping to chase this and put time into moving hosting. Gddy has been reasonably good. But for what I am approaching next, I need a more responsive support as it is being built in Joomla.

So while the mail function would be good, it is not highest priority since I will be moving at some point. Now, if this were a dynamic site, which I will be constructing soon, that would be a different story. Much greater need to monitor. I built massive intrusive/detection mechanisms in the past. Global. So I know monitoring and analysis.

What the chasing the mail tail has done tho is... time to move hosting. Time better spent. Tho admit... I like to see things work... figure stuff out. Aka we all are gearheads, I believe.

Which brings me to... yet again I very much appreciate the time you and @toivo took to present solutions. I dug into it late last eve, and a bit this morn. Knowledge greatly enhanced, and info is filed for reference if I run into this again. Hopefully I am smarter than that.. to land with a Joomla centric hosting platform. So your time means everything to me. No question it contributed to my knowing I need to move hosting sooner rather than later.

tx

sozzled wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:40 pm
As a general observation, @toivo is partly correct.

On the one hand, how you've organised email services with your webhost is outside J!. On the other hand, J! will use whatever you've organised with your webhost, provided you have configured that service within J! Global Configuration settings and the webhost's email works irrespective of whether J! can use it or not.

If your J! website has problems with sending mail then @toivo has given you a few pointers on how to diagnose those problems. If your email just doesn't work at all then that's what needs to be fixed first.

On the other hand, in view of the fact that you had problems (in another forum discussion) receiving email from this forum, when you wrote:
drh3rdiii wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 8:31 pm
after some changes, am now getting a 'email sent successfully' reported by Joomla but it never arrives.
this suggests that the email may be dispatched but it's disappearing into the ether (or, perhaps, your email client application is rejecting its reception or putting it into a spam folder). What I sometimes do in these situations is connect to the email "server" using a browser-based webmail client and poke around in there. The problem could be at the server end or it could be at the client end. :pop

I don't know whether SSL is involved; the last time I looked, the website you had problems with did not have a SSL certificate attached to it and, for that reason (possibly) you may have to consider not using SSL-secured email. Regardless of whether SSL is involved—all my domains have valid SSL certificates—I mainly use PHP Mail (the default) with my J! websites.

We could "make some changes"—I don't know what they may be or what you've done—and carry on this discussion on a turn-based discussion forum, or we could cut through difficulties of typing and just talk about it. Back to you.

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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by sozzled » Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:51 pm

As I've written before, some time talking this through via teleconference may provide a solution. It's your call. I have nothing further to add to this discussion at the moment.
“If you think I’m wrong then say, ‘I think you’re wrong.’ If you say ‘You’re wrong!’, how do you know?” :)
Testing J! 3.10: https://sintranet.enduring.com.au

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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by drh3rdiii » Thu Jun 24, 2021 10:00 pm

Wanted to respond a bit more, even tho all this has jogged me to move hosting sooner rather than later.

One reason that was a smack upside the head was yes, the host should make SSL available in PHP. Yeppers. I had updated PHP for starters, then tried thru CPanel to add the openssl extension. Went in circles as it was not one of the extension addons. So did it manually, as have done often. Restarted Apache. No go. Not available. That's when I called support. Now, I landed with someone who admitted they did not know the level of what I was asking, even tho the phone choice was for security and SSL. Sigh. I was like, you're kidding? Not vocally. But this is fundamental. So when I asked if they compiled openssl into that version of PHP and go crickets, that is when I knew I needed to switch hosting.

I had mail working in the prior iterations of Joomla installs. So with a little tweaking, I was able to get an 'email sent successfully', but it never arrived. I did this through two different email SMTP entities. Same saying success but no receipt.

Sooooooooo, as mentioned in separate post... became a no brainer. Time to move. Am building a new, interactive centric Joomla in a local LAMP (done this a bazillion times), so all this just became obvious. Move to Joomla friendly hosting.

I appreciate the time you took to engineer the response. And just gave me an idea. I will go back to my LAMP virtual machine and see if I can get mail to work here. Of all the things I built on the internet, running mail servers was my least fav. Constant building tools to protect against the barbarians at the gates.

Anywayzzz... your response and the time you took, I am deeply appreciative.

drh
toivo wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 7:24 am
Your host should make SSL available in PHP. That has nothing to do with Joomla.

If your host allows you to use an external mail server, get the settings from the host managing the mail server. For example Google SMTP is available, if your web host allows the website to connect to an external SMTP server, rather than their own mail server:

How do I use Gmail as my mail server

You can get a detailed log of all the messages exchanged between the Joomla site and the SMTP server. Inspect this transaction log and it shows what is going wrong between the two servers at the SMTP protocol level. Then get your IT department, hosting or email provider to resolve any connectivity issues.

Go to Extensions - Plugins and configure the system plugin 'System - Debug' with the following settings:
  • Allowed Groups: Super Users
  • Log Priorities: All
  • Log Categories: mail
  • Log Almost Everything
Go to Global Configuration and turn on the debug option in the System tab - Debug Settings - Debug System.

Go to the Server tab - Mail Settings and click the button Send Test Mail.

The test result, success or failure, will then get displayed as a system message, but you can download the detailed log file 'everything.php' from the Joomla log folder, usually administrator/logs, or, if your site was installed much earlier, from the /logs folder in the main Joomla folder.

The SMTP status codes and error messages are often not self-explanatory. In that case post the relevant lines from the log here for assistance.

drh3rdiii
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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by drh3rdiii » Thu Jun 24, 2021 10:09 pm

sozzled wrote:
Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:51 pm
As I've written before, some time talking this through via teleconference may provide a solution. It's your call. I have nothing further to add to this discussion at the moment.
Much appreciated. This chapter that started yesterday landed me at... change hosting. Too many mini battles that I will end up redoing soon anyway. Tho I might spend a few mins fussing with a virtual machine LAMP where I did all my re-dev work. And see if I can get mail working. But only plan on spending a few mins.

So not worth your or my time wrestling with... since I will be moving hosting anyway. As I mentioned in prior post, when I got onto support specifically for SSL, Certs, Security... and the gent couldn't answer the fundamental "you guys compile openssl' into your PHP, yes?"... and there were crickets, that is when I knew it was time to move. All of us.

Trust me tho... as I mentioned in out vidconf call, I have been exceedingly grateful for the responses, the expressions of time and expertise, from this community. Been doing this for a long time and it has not always been wine and roses. But the last few days of exchanges... top shelf. So grateful.

I will ping you for sure when I run into a real issue that I researched up the yin yang and finally know I need help. For sure.

This is always that question I posed earlier... where might one go to ping some developers, engineers, who roll up sleeves and discuss... projects. That is a current pursuit...

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Re: Joomla eMail from admin backend help please...

Post by sozzled » Thu Jun 24, 2021 10:17 pm

As you wish. This is a fundamental webhosting question. Thousands of people use GoDaddy and they don't seem to encounter the problems you're having. A proportion of GoDaddy's customers use J!; GoDaddy promotes webhosting for J! as part of its product suite. Regardless of whether you obtained good customer service from this company—I have no view on the matter and it is inappropriate for people to use this forum as a "wall of shame" if they have a negative opinion about certain webhosting providers—I should imagine this question can be answered in a few minutes (without too much trouble) if you're willing to invest that time.

I can't say more than that. AFAIK, GoDaddy works with J!. 8)
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