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Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:48 pm
by mikerotec
OK, installing on apache PHP7.1.23 MySQL8

Install went fine, added sample data... Everything reported OK, no errors.
Final step - go to front end and it's an EMPTY site, go to back end and find an EMPTY backend...
Click on the Home on front end, it reloads the page.
Click on the top left Joomla Icon in backend, it reloads the page ( Which is optimistically titled "Control Panel")
But that is ALL you can do in the backend... no menus or controls are present...
I checked the database, and there are 64 tables created in there! 538 rows, 3.7MB data
Any ideas for a quick fix? Or do I need to wipe?
J4A5-test-install.png

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:11 pm
by mikerotec
Ah... on further review I see that it is some kind of template / menu issue!

if I PASTE in some back end URLS ( like /administrator/index.php?option=com_menus&view=menus for example) It does open up the page in question. Just no menubars present...

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:14 pm
by mikerotec
And.. I can navigate around quite well... punching in different admin URs manually is working fine so far. I see there is an active default Admin template...
J4A5-test-install-no-admin.png

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:25 pm
by toivo
It may be best to start from scratch. I installed earlier Alpha 5 with demo data and the back end was working all right.

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:29 pm
by mikerotec
OK, wipe, rinse and repeat it is!

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:50 pm
by mikerotec
Sadly: full wipe and reinstall did nothing to improve the situation. Maybe I have a bad installer package download ? ( I got today's latest... ) I shall go looking for another one!

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Fri Nov 09, 2018 8:11 am
by toivo
It would be better to use the Alpha 5 version, rather than the nightly builds, which may be unstable. I noticed that with the dev versions after one of the earlier Alphas.

If you would like others to have a look if there is something obvious in the configuration, post the results from the Forum Post Assistant (FPA) by following the instructions at viewtopic.php?f=714&t=793531.

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:12 pm
by mikerotec
Just did another test install with alpha 5 version ( downloaded from https://github.com/joomla/joomla-cms/re ... 0.0-alpha5 ) - exactly the same problem

here is the PFA output:
Problem Description :: Forum Post Assistant (v1.4.5 (Ganymede)) : 14th November 2018 wrote:install completes no errors: but no menus in front or back end
Forum Post Assistant (v1.4.5 (Ganymede)) : 14th November 2018 wrote:
Basic Environment :: wrote:Joomla! Instance :: Joomla! 4.0.0-alpha5-Alpha (Amani) 4-November-2018
Joomla! Configured :: Yes | Writable (644) | Owner: --protected-- . (uid: /gid: ) | Group: --protected-- (gid: ) | Valid For: 4.0
Configuration Options :: Offline: false | SEF: true | SEF Suffix: false | SEF ReWrite: false | .htaccess/web.config: No | GZip: false | Cache: false | CacheTime: 15 | CacheHandler: file | CachePlatformPrefix: false | FTP Layer: false | Proxy: N/A | LiveSite: | Session lifetime: 15 | Session handler: database | Shared sessions: false | SSL: N/A | Error Reporting: default | Site Debug: false | Language Debug: false | Default Access: 1 | Unicode Slugs: false | dbConnection Type: mysqli | PHP Supports J! 4.0.0-alpha5: Yes | Database Credentials Present: Yes |

Host Configuration :: OS: Linux | OS Version: 4.15.0-23-generic | Technology: x86_64 | Web Server: Apache/2.4.6 (CentOS) PHP/7.1.23 | Encoding: gzip, deflate | Doc Root: --protected-- | System TMP Writable: Yes | Free Disk Space : 10.18 GiB |

PHP Configuration :: Version: 7.1.23 | PHP API: apache2handler | Session Path Writable: Yes | Display Errors: 1 | Error Reporting: 22527 | Log Errors To: | Last Known Error: | Register Globals: | Magic Quotes: | Safe Mode: | Open Base: | Uploads: 1 | Max. Upload Size: 24M | Max. POST Size: 8M | Max. Input Time: 60 | Max. Execution Time: 30 | Memory Limit: 128M

Database Configuration :: Version: 8.0.13 (Client:mysqlnd 5.0.12-dev - 20150407 - $Id: 38fea24f2847fa7519001be390c98ae0acafe387 $) | Host: --protected-- (--protected--) | Localhost: Yes | Collation: utf8mb4_0900_ai_ci (Character Set: utf8mb4) | Database Size: 3.72 MiB | #of Tables:  64
Detailed Environment :: wrote:PHP Extensions :: Core (7.1.23) | date (7.1.23) | libxml (7.1.23) | openssl (7.1.23) | pcre (7.1.23) | zlib (7.1.23) | filter (7.1.23) | hash (1.0) | Reflection (7.1.23) | SPL (7.1.23) | session (7.1.23) | standard (7.1.23) | apache2handler () | bz2 (7.1.23) | calendar (7.1.23) | ctype (7.1.23) | curl (7.1.23) | dom (20031129) | mbstring (7.1.23) | fileinfo (1.0.5) | ftp (7.1.23) | gd (7.1.23) | gettext (7.1.23) | iconv (7.1.23) | json (1.5.0) | exif (7.1.23) | mcrypt (7.1.23) | mysqlnd (mysqlnd 5.0.12-dev - 20150407 - $Id: 38fea24f2847fa7519001be390c98ae0acafe387 $) | PDO (7.1.23) | Phar (2.0.2) | SimpleXML (7.1.23) | sockets (7.1.23) | sqlite3 (7.1.23) | tokenizer (7.1.23) | xml (7.1.23) | xmlwriter (7.1.23) | xsl (7.1.23) | zip (1.13.5) | mysqli (7.1.23) | pdo_mysql (7.1.23) | pdo_sqlite (7.1.23) | wddx (7.1.23) | xmlreader (7.1.23) | xmlrpc (7.1.23) | Zend Engine (3.1.0) |
Potential Missing Extensions ::

Switch User Environment (Experimental) :: PHP CGI: No | Server SU: No | PHP SU: No | Custom SU (LiteSpeed/Cloud/Grid): No
Potential Ownership Issues: Maybe

Apache Modules :: core | mod_so | http_core | mod_access_compat | mod_actions | mod_alias | mod_allowmethods | mod_auth_basic | mod_auth_digest | mod_authn_anon | mod_authn_core | mod_authn_dbd | mod_authn_dbm | mod_authn_file | mod_authn_socache | mod_authz_core | mod_authz_dbd | mod_authz_dbm | mod_authz_groupfile | mod_authz_host | mod_authz_owner | mod_authz_user | mod_autoindex | mod_cache | mod_cache_disk | mod_data | mod_dbd | mod_deflate | mod_dir | mod_dumpio | mod_echo | mod_env | mod_expires | mod_ext_filter | mod_filter | mod_headers | mod_include | mod_info | mod_log_config | mod_logio | mod_mime_magic | mod_mime | mod_negotiation | mod_remoteip | mod_reqtimeout | mod_rewrite | mod_setenvif | mod_slotmem_plain | mod_slotmem_shm | mod_socache_dbm | mod_socache_memcache | mod_socache_shmcb | mod_status | mod_substitute | mod_suexec | mod_unique_id | mod_unixd | mod_userdir | mod_version | mod_vhost_alias | mod_dav | mod_dav_fs | mod_dav_lock | mod_lua | prefork | mod_proxy | mod_lbmethod_bybusyness | mod_lbmethod_byrequests | mod_lbmethod_bytraffic | mod_lbmethod_heartbeat | mod_proxy_ajp | mod_proxy_balancer | mod_proxy_connect | mod_proxy_express | mod_proxy_fcgi | mod_proxy_fdpass | mod_proxy_ftp | mod_proxy_http | mod_proxy_scgi | mod_proxy_wstunnel | mod_systemd | mod_cgi | mod_php7 | Apache/2.4.6 (CentOS) PHP/7.1.23 |
Potential Missing Modules :: mod_security | mod_evasive | mod_dosevasive | mod_ssl | mod_qos | mod_userdir |
Folder Permissions :: wrote:Core Folders :: images/ (755) | components/ (755) | modules/ (755) | plugins/ (755) | language/ (755) | templates/ (755) | cache/ (755) | logs/ (---) | tmp/ (755) | administrator/components/ (755) | administrator/modules/ (755) | administrator/language/ (755) | administrator/templates/ (755) | administrator/logs/ (755) |

Elevated Permissions (First 10) ::
Database Information :: wrote:Database statistics :: Uptime: 1282937 | Threads: 2 | Questions: 51207 | Slow queries: 0 | Opens: 3582 | Flush tables: 4 | Open tables: 1880 | Queries per second avg: 0.039 |
Extensions Discovered :: wrote:Components :: SITE ::
Core ::
3rd Party::

Components :: ADMIN ::
Core :: com_menus (4.0.0) 1 | com_fields (4.0.0) 1 | com_checkin (4.0.0) 1 | com_messages (4.0.0) 1 | com_search (4.0.0) 1 | com_associations (4.0.0) 1 | com_plugins (4.0.0) 1 | com_newsfeeds (4.0.0) 1 | com_banners (4.0.0) 1 | com_ajax (4.0.0) 1 | com_cpanel (4.0.0) 1 | com_templates (4.0.0) 1 | com_categories (4.0.0) 1 | com_contenthistory (4.0.0) 1 | com_redirect (4.0.0) 1 | com_finder (4.0.0) 1 | com_admin (4.0.0) 1 | com_media (3.0.0) 1 | com_login (4.0.0) 1 | com_config (4.0.0) 1 | com_cache (4.0.0) 1 | com_installer (4.0.0) 1 | com_csp (4.0.0) 1 | com_modules (4.0.0) 1 | com_mailto (4.0.0) 1 | com_content (4.0.0) 1 | com_joomlaupdate (4.0.0) 1 | com_postinstall (4.0.0) 1 | com_languages (4.0.0) 1 | com_workflow (4.0.0) 1 | com_users (4.0.0) 1 | com_tags (4.0.0) 1 | com_wrapper (4.0.0) 1 |
3rd Party::

Modules :: SITE ::
Core :: mod_syndicate (3.0.0) 1 | mod_finder (3.0.0) 1 | mod_articles_latest (3.0.0) 1 | mod_feed (3.0.0) 1 | mod_languages (3.5.0) 1 | mod_random_image (3.0.0) 1 | mod_articles_categories (3.0.0) 1 | mod_search (3.0.0) 1 | mod_whosonline (3.0.0) 1 | mod_wrapper (3.0.0) 1 | mod_custom (3.0.0) 1 | mod_articles_popular (3.0.0) 1 | mod_tags_popular (3.1.0) 1 | mod_breadcrumbs (3.0.0) 1 | mod_footer (3.0.0) 1 | mod_tags_similar (3.1.0) 1 | mod_articles_news (3.0.0) 1 | mod_banners (3.0.0) 1 | mod_articles_category (3.0.0) 1 | mod_related_items (3.0.0) 1 | mod_articles_archive (3.0.0) 1 | mod_login (3.0.0) 1 | mod_users_latest (3.0.0) 1 | mod_stats (3.0.0) 1 | mod_menu (3.0.0) 1 |
3rd Party::

Modules :: ADMIN ::
Core :: mod_custom (3.0.0) 1 | mod_toolbar (3.0.0) 1 | mod_stats_admin (3.0.0) 1 | mod_menu (3.0.0) 1 | mod_popular (3.0.0) 1 | mod_sampledata (3.8.0) 1 | mod_quickicon (3.0.0) 1 | mod_logged (3.0.0) 1 | mod_multilangstatus (3.0.0) 1 | mod_login (3.0.0) 1 | mod_title (3.0.0) 1 | mod_version (3.0.0) 1 | mod_latest (3.0.0) 1 | mod_feed (3.0.0) 1 | mod_status (3.0.0) 1 |
3rd Party::

Plugins :: SITE ::
Core :: plg_filesystem_local (4.0.0) 1 | plg_sampledata_multilang (4.0.0) 1 | plg_fields_list (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_checkboxes (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_media (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_textarea (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_imagelist (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_calendar (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_user (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_integer (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_usergrouplist (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_color (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_radio (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_url (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_sql (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_editor (3.7.0) 1 | plg_fields_text (3.7.0) 1 | plg_search_content (3.0.0) 1 | plg_search_tags (3.0.0) 1 | plg_search_contacts (3.0.0) 1 | plg_search_newsfeeds (3.0.0) 1 | plg_search_categories (3.0.0) 1 | plg_twofactorauth_yubikey (3.2.0) 0 | plg_twofactorauth_totp (3.2.0) 0 | plg_finder_tags (3.0.0) 1 | plg_finder_categories (3.0.0) 1 | plg_finder_content (3.0.0) 1 | plg_finder_contacts (3.0.0) 1 | plg_finder_newsfeeds (3.0.0) 1 | plg_system_updatenotification (3.5.0) 1 | plg_system_highlight (3.0.0) 1 | plg_system_log (3.0.0) 1 | plg_system_sessiongc (3.8.6) 1 | plg_system_stats (3.5.0) 1 | plg_system_sef (3.0.0) 1 | plg_system_languagefilter (3.0.0) 0 | plg_system_fields (3.7.0) 1 | plg_system_httpheaders (4.0.0) 1 | plg_system_remember (3.0.0) 1 | plg_system_languagecode (3.0.0) 0 | plg_system_debug (3.0.0) 1 | plg_system_cache (3.0.0) 0 | plg_system_redirect (3.0.0) 0 | plg_system_logout (3.0.0) 1 | plg_installer_override (4.0.0) 1 | plg_installer_webinstaller (1.1.1) 1 | plg_installer_folderinstaller (3.6.0) 1 | plg_installer_packageinstaller (3.6.0) 1 | plg_installer_urlinstaller (3.6.0) 1 | plg_user_profile (3.0.0) 0 | plg_user_contactcreator (3.0.0) 0 | plg_user_joomla (3.0.0) 1 | plg_extension_namespacemap (4.0.0) 1 | plg_extension_joomla (3.0.0) 1 | plg_behaviour_taggable (4.0.0.) 1 | plg_behaviour_versionable (4.0.0.) 1 | plg_editors-xtd_article (3.0.0) 1 | plg_editors-xtd_readmore (3.0.0) 1 | plg_editors-xtd_pagebreak (3.0.0) 1 | plg_editors-xtd_fields (3.7.0) 1 | plg_editors-xtd_menu (3.7.0) 1 | plg_editors-xtd_image (3.0.0) 1 | plg_editors-xtd_module (3.5.0) 1 | plg_authentication_cookie (3.0.0) 1 | plg_authentication_joomla (3.0.0) 1 | plg_authentication_ldap (3.0.0) 0 | plg_media-action_resize (4.0.0) 1 | plg_media-action_rotate (4.0.0) 1 | plg_media-action_crop (4.0.0) 1 | plg_quickicon_phpversioncheck (3.7.0) 1 | plg_quickicon_extensionupdate (3.0.0) 1 | plg_quickicon_joomlaupdate (3.0.0) 1 | plg_quickicon_overridecheck (4.0.0) 1 | plg_captcha_recaptcha (3.4.0) 0 | plg_content_finder (3.0.0) 0 | plg_content_joomla (3.0.0) 1 | plg_content_fields (3.7.0) 1 | plg_content_emailcloak (3.0.0) 1 | plg_content_pagenavigation (3.0.0) 1 | plg_content_pagebreak (3.0.0) 1 | plg_content_vote (3.0.0) 0 | plg_content_loadmodule (3.0.0) 1 |
3rd Party:: plg_editors_tinymce (4.8.3) 1 | plg_editors_codemirror (5.35.0) 1 |
Templates Discovered :: wrote:Templates :: SITE :: cassiopeia (1.0) 1 |
Templates :: ADMIN :: atum (1.0) 1 |

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:33 pm
by toivo
MySQL 8 can be causing issues:
https://docs.joomla.org/Joomla_and_MySQL_8

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 7:49 pm
by mikerotec
Wow, that's very very weird... everything appears normal when I surf it via pasting in URLS in the backend, aside from no menus (or action buttons!).

I even tried an update to alpha 6, and that appears to have gone perfectly fine:

Code: Select all

#Date: 2018-11-14 19:31:55 UTC
#Software: Joomla! 4.0.0-alpha5 Alpha [ Amani ] 4-November-2018 23:23 GMT

#Fields: datetime	priority clientip	category	message
2018-11-14T19:31:55+00:00	INFO 10.1.1.7	update	Starting installation of new version.
2018-11-14T19:31:59+00:00	INFO 10.1.1.7	update	Finalising installation.
2018-11-14T19:32:00+00:00	INFO 10.1.1.7	update	Cleaning up after installation.
2018-11-14T19:32:00+00:00	INFO 10.1.1.7	update	Update to version 4.0.0-alpha6-dev is complete.

( the 'update' went fine, but I still have no menus, etc!)


MySQL 8 has been the Stable GA release since APRIL of 2018... I sincerely hope that Joomla puts some priority on making itself compatible ... :eek:

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 9:23 pm
by sozzled
I confess that I have never installed alpha versions of Joomla before and I haven't even attempted any installation of J! 4. I've taken this approach because, in past alpha/beta releases of Joomla, there's always been the caveat that, if one trials these pre-release versions, there's little or no guarantee that these websites will remain functional in the long term; there may be untested situations (starting with a pre-release version as the base) within the updating procedure that cause problems downstream.

I suppose, because of the folklore surrounding the unreliabilty in maintaining previous Joomla alphas/betas in the past, I'm reluctant to get stuck into J! 4 at this time apart from engaging in the running commentary.

The second point that I want to make is that there's limited or zero support for any alpha software release; working through defects discovered with alpha software requires an intimate knowledge of how the whole system hangs together—knowledge that, despite broad skills practised over 40+ years in the IT industry, is not really something that I can bring to bear in an unfamiliar environment such as J! 4.

I've taken a few simple precautions so that, when the time comes, I'll be prepared for J! 4 and with the expectation that I'll be able to migrate my J! 3 websites to J! 4 as best as the migration facilities will permit. I may have to change a few things (e.g. templates and extensions) but time will tell.

The last observation I'll make at this time is that, even though all successive versions of Joomla have attempted to take advantage of the current trends in website hosting software (i.e. Apache, PHP and MySQL), the general approach taken by Joomla framework and CMS developers has been something of a compromise. Yes, the overall strategy (to utilise PHP 7 and Bootstrap 5, for example) accepts the belief that certain software and site construction practices are mature enough and have an established market that can be enjoyed by the majority of inexperienced/hobbyist website owners as well as by seasoned professionals who may be seeking to extend the bounds of what lies within "the package". Because there often have to be compromises made, it's likely that some new technologies cannot be catered to in developing a new product. That is to say, the arrival of MySQL 8—notwithstanding its release in April this year—doesn't mean that J! 4's architecture should be changed at this alpha testing point in the project life-cycle.

I don't know what the future of MySQL 8 holds for commercial webhosting companies; I don't know whether hobbyist website owners will notice any real difference in terms of functionality, reliability or performance. It's always nice to get a little extra "oomph" when a new facility becomes available but, to what extent is that extra really worth it in practical use? Perhaps, if the website was running as many millions of transactions per second as, say, eBay, then there's a strong case to be made for how the architecture of the website becomes one of the most important decisions.

So, while we're in the alpha testing phase, if MySQL 8 compatibility can be easily accommodated without rewriting J! 4 then that's a nice thing, I guess. I don't think it's a necessary requirement that this should become a priority in order for a stable release of J! 4, however.

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 10:19 pm
by mikerotec
That's a good point - BUT... seeing as Joomla 3.8 and 3.9 RUN ABSOLUTELY WELL on top of MySQL 8, and as the Official Requirements listings for Joomla say nothing whatsoever about the current release of MySQL being "Verbotten!!" - (only that MySQL must meet or exceed a minimum 5.1 version) - and that between now and the eventual release of 3.10 "upgrade-to-J4-ready" version there could be hundreds if not thousands of new Joomla installations purring along smoothly on MySQL8... I think it's quite essential for Joomla to get any little glitches related to MySQL8 sorted double-quick.

Otherwise, all hell is gonna break loose when a whole lot of upgrades start to happen, and the MySQL8 glitches raise their ugly heads for unsuspecting users.

And how can we properly TEST J4/MySQL8 compatibility when we can't even get a properly working INSTALL on it? :eek:

If MySQL8 was still in beta, I wouldn't be making this point, but MySQL8 RC was more than a year ago - and beta was more than TWO years ago...

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2018 11:34 pm
by mikerotec
UPDATE: I was able to solve this by updating J4 to Alpha 6 (pasted in URL to get to the update page upload page) and THEN running this recommended database hack:

UPDATE `{databasePrefix}_modules` SET `checked_out_time` = '1000-01-01 00:00:00', `publish_up` = '1000-01-01 00:00:00', `publish_down` = '1000-01-01 00:00:00';

After doing that, both the back end and the front end have menus that function!

(I actually had tried the same db hack earlier when it was Alpha5, but it didn't work for me then...)

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2018 5:55 am
by sozzled
Fair comments and I'm pleased that you sorted things out. :) Cheers.

Re: Joomla 4 A5 - test install comes up EMPTY

Posted: Sat Nov 17, 2018 12:50 am
by mikerotec
Well, as it happens, that db hack was only a PARTIAL fix. The first time I tried to install something, it crashed and burned. And all possible workarounds just ended up in "losing the modules/menus" again.

Accordingly, I have decided to roll back my DEV servers to MySQL5.7
( and of course, the J4A5 install went smoothly then! ).

Moral of story: :'( No (MySQL8) Soup For You! :'( (maybe in a couple of years...)

I still recommend that the Joomla "Requirements" page should be updated with a ' ̷M̷y̷S̷Q̷L̷ ̷8̷' warning ASAP...