The J! 4 testing team

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sozzled
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The J! 4 testing team

Post by sozzled » Sun May 24, 2020 8:33 pm

We've had several discussions about problems that we, as ordinary people, are having with using J! 4. One of those discussions is entitled "What's holding back the release of Joomla 4 going into Beta?" It's a good question.

A short summary of that discussion, to use @brian's words, is
brian wrote:
Mon Jan 13, 2020 3:38 pm
If people don't test things now it will never get to beta
I agree. Testing is important; testing is an investment (as @brian wrote):
brian wrote:
Tue Jan 14, 2020 4:31 pm
Yes time is money. Therefore testing is an investment.
I agree with that, too. 8)

My question is simple: where is the J! 4 testing team?

In addition, I would also ask, what is OSM's investment in backing a J! 4 testing team? Does a team exist? What are the qualifications needed for people to join this team? Who is the team leader? What is the purpose of such a team? How do I and others join this team? How often does the team meet? How do team members collaborate with and report back to other team members about their testing activities?

What has occurred in the four months since @brian wrote what he did on the forum? Has his advice converted into action?

So, while I agree with the need for people to test J! 4 so that we can move past the alpha phase and into beta and beyond, how should we go about these tasks? I don't propose that OSM should create a testing team/working group as an official part of the organisation but I don't see any discussion from departmental reports to get this activity off the ground. Can someone please point me to where this activity is discussed and what pre-requisites are needed for people to get involved with testing J! 4, please?
https://www.kuneze.com/blog
“If you think I’m wrong then say, ‘I think you’re wrong.’ If you say ‘You’re wrong!’, how do you know?” :)

 
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Re: The J! 4 testing team

Post by toivo » Mon May 25, 2020 1:55 am

sozzled wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 8:33 pm
My question is simple: where is the J! 4 testing team?
The testing team consists of me, you, the Joomla! community, of course.

Many developers report bugs in Joomla! Issue Tracker CMS, develop a fix as a Pull Request (PR) in their area of expertise in the core code and also test each others' PRs.

sozzled wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 8:33 pm
How do I and others join this team? How often does the team meet? How do team members collaborate with and report back to other team members about their testing activities?
Those questions are addressed at least partially in my reply to the topic What holding back the release of Joomla 4 b1 now?.

sozzled wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 8:33 pm
So, while I agree with the need for people to test J! 4 so that we can move past the alpha phase and into beta and beyond, how should we go about these tasks?
Ibid.

sozzled wrote:
Sun May 24, 2020 8:33 pm
Can someone please point me to where this activity is discussed and what pre-requisites are needed for people to get involved with testing J! 4, please?
Ibid.
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Re: The J! 4 testing team

Post by sozzled » Mon May 25, 2020 2:04 am

Thank you, @toivo. I'm talking about end user/functionality testing, what's in it for all of us, and how best we can invest our time in these activities.

I do not see an end user working group (steered by a non-technical person, comprised primarily of end users with the assistance of someone from the developer team, someone from the documentation group and, perhaps, someone from the marketing area) who have contacts within their respective areas and can liaise between them. If the focus at the moment is on component testing then we're a way off from moving into Beta.

I propose that, to facilitate the move to Beta, we tackle the end user testing matter. We can then identify critical "show stoppers" and consider ideas about how to manage them. Does this seem reasonable?
https://www.kuneze.com/blog
“If you think I’m wrong then say, ‘I think you’re wrong.’ If you say ‘You’re wrong!’, how do you know?” :)

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Re: The J! 4 testing team

Post by darb » Tue May 26, 2020 11:34 am

Have you seen joined this discussions Sozzled? viewtopic.php?f=803&t=979586
Success in the long run Its not about the code its about the people and community that's make it!
Its not what you say its what you do that matters!

Darb - aka ssnobben

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Re: The J! 4 testing team

Post by MACKTEK » Fri May 29, 2020 10:32 am

I am curious, is there some reason that above link'd post is not stickied?

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Re: The J! 4 testing team

Post by toivo » Fri May 29, 2020 10:43 am

If you mean the link in @darb's post, anyone can download the Joomla 4 Beta1 Development version from Nightly Builds and install a test site on localhost or in a sub folder of their remote server, then maybe ask relevant questions in this Joomla 4 Related forum first and then possibly report bugs at https://issues.joomla.org.

The availability of the first official Beta will be announced in the Announcements forum, hopefully in the not too distant future.
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Re: The J! 4 testing team

Post by sozzled » Fri May 29, 2020 8:05 pm

I discovered a "little secret". The secret is an article published in this month's edition of the Joomla Community Magazine that starts with
I will let you into a little secret, one that others in production will never tell. When is Joomla! 4 ready? Well, that’s simple.

When it’s been fully tested and the bugs fixed.
If that is not patronising enough, for us poor souls who lack information about how J! 4 is progressing and seems to place the blame for the inability to progress J! 4 beyond alpha, then the rest of the article puts a lot of emphasis on using alternative mechanisms (e.g. GitHub, Zoom, Glip) for people to get involved. To put it another way, this forum is largely worthless if people want to find out what's happening; "officially-speaking" (i.e. going on the published reports I've found), J! 4 doesn't seem to be a big deal as far as OSM is concerned (because the lack of progress and accountability is not a priority at OSM Board meetings) and there's no real enthusiasm within OSM to progress J! 4 with any sense of priority. If I could put this in even simpler terms, J! 4 will advance at its own pace, without any real support or push from "above".

So it's left to us poor mugs to accept things as they are and, to use @toivo's words in another place, "hope" that something will happen "in the not too distant future". It may sound like I'm overstating the obvious, but we've been "hoping" for four years.

My criticism notwithstanding, I found the "little secret" and I encourage others to discover this secret, too, if people are genuinely serious about getting involved with testing J! 4.
https://www.kuneze.com/blog
“If you think I’m wrong then say, ‘I think you’re wrong.’ If you say ‘You’re wrong!’, how do you know?” :)

 

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