matching your client with the design

[franco]

was thinking kanina, while in the process of designing a site:  yung site na ginagawa ko para sa client na medyo may edad na, not too internet savvy, and, basically easy to please.  so, when i finally took a break from designing what i thought was a pretty lame layout, i began thinking, there are things that are necessary:  meta tags, flow of info, navigability, and color coordination.  pero, i began thinking that at least for me, the extent of my design, and the amount of time i give it, really depends upon how much of an a_s the client would be/is. the less demanding, the less time or effort i give it.  but, the more demanding, even if the pay is the same, the more effort.

question:  is that just me or is that the case for you, too? me, i'm inherently lazy so, that's my excuse.  ano'ng excuse mo?

[franco]

by the way, yung site na ginagawa ko:  http://ccapi.org

[chette]

Hi Franco. This is a nice topic Yes, I also used to be the same way, hehe. Hindi maiiwasan eh. Parang professor sa college yan -- magaaral ka lang mabuti kung alam mong mabagsik yung teacher and ibabagsak ka.

I said I used to be like that, because right now, I have to force myself to think of my business like portfolio management. I read an interesting article in TechRepublic kasi.

Right now, I give more attention and efforts to clients who actually sustain the business, even if their needs are the simplest things. It takes a while to get used to, but I lost a couple of important clients in the past, and I don't want that to happen again.

[guilliam]

good thread indeed!

its not basically of being LAZY.. its about time management and how youre going to distribute your time on the projects. yes i know i've used LAZY, but the point of using that adapted statement from yours is that, MORE demanding clients boils down to MORE time you will spend in the project.

thus, this will lead you having more little time and to extent spending longer time on a project tends to loose your interest in finishing it or delivering it completed.

about the RATE.. its always true that "the client who pays lesser, are those clients that CRIES LOUDER!"

guilliam

[aldrin]

Based on my experiences:

Pinakamatrabaho ang mga "Charity Projects"
Hindi tama ang sobrang "User-Friendly"
Malas ka kapag "Designer Wannabe" ang client mo

Umm.. tsaka before ako magdesign, I make sure na napagusapan muna namin lahat. Actually, meron akong questionnaire na binibigay sa kanila and it helps a lot!  ::)

[keyser_soze]

is it the client or the client's target users? at least the primary target users as there is always that "general public".

one thing that surely helps is to define the expectations upfront and this includes agreeing on a site defintion with the client. its also up to us, i think to educate our clients. some just want their wish lists done even how outrageous they seem to be. worse, they're not even ready to spend for all the features.

i am a process-oriented person (sometimes i overdo it). there are a lot of website devt processes out there but one that actually ticks, at least in my experience, is kelly goto's  (gotomedia.com). been using that process since, not to the letter actually.

i think when websites started, people are so preoccupied with the visual design until almost all websites looked the same that web gurus begun talking about usability. i think usability is essential and its implementation differs from one website project to another. im not a big fan of that nielsen guy (who's he) though. think he's extreme. and with usability comes content organization. its quite tempting to start a website project with visualizing how it appears then think of the contents later. like putting the cart in front of the horse. although i must admit that in reality, when you're faced with a new project, its always a tough balancing act. this what makes cmses like mambo so appealing to me. not only can you separate design from content but more importantly, it gives you the opportunity to think more of your content and develop a visual design around it.

my two cents worth.

vik 

[teng]

hello, i think kahit hindi demanding ang nagpapagawa dapat same quality pareho ang ibigay mo.
based on my experience, clients who are art-savvey are more meticulous in the designs. guilliam is right it's not laziness but time management. you could speak of qualiy even if the design is just simple but looks clean and in symmetry like http://www.aurum3.com. it's also important na napaguusapan ang gusto ng client beforehand and put it in writing bago ang lahat. ask the client kung may web site where he or she is inspired of. in that case alam mo na kung ano ang taste nya. 

regards,

[aldrin]

hello, i think kahit hindi demanding ang nagpapagawa dapat same quality pareho ang ibigay mo.
based on my experience, clients who are art-savvey are more meticulous in the designs. guilliam is right it's not laziness but time management. you could speak of qualiy even if the design is just simple but looks clean and in symmetry like http://www.aurum3.com. it's also important na napaguusapan ang gusto ng client beforehand and put it in writing bago ang lahat. ask the client kung may web site where he or she is inspired of. in that case alam mo na kung ano ang taste nya. 

regards,

Tama! Unfortunately, we can't blame our fellow designers/developers. In my case, sometimes nakikipag argue talaga ako about the design. Yun nga lang client always win. Ewan ko ba? Sakit na yata ito naming mga designers.. in the afternoon gumagana ang aming mga utak.. an hour before maguwian! Wahehehe... hindi naman lagi... pero madalas!

[teng]

Yun lang, yun siguro yung tinatawag na adrenalin (hmm, sounds aldrin  ) rush. Kung kaylan deadline saka nagra-rush. Hahaha 

[audienceone]

hello, i think kahit hindi demanding ang nagpapagawa dapat same quality pareho ang ibigay mo.
based on my experience, clients who are art-savvey are more meticulous in the designs. guilliam is right it's not laziness but time management. you could speak of qualiy even if the design is just simple but looks clean and in symmetry like http://www.aurum3.com. it's also important na napaguusapan ang gusto ng client beforehand and put it in writing bago ang lahat. ask the client kung may web site where he or she is inspired of. in that case alam mo na kung ano ang taste nya. 

regards,

I agree that it all boils down to time management.

When it comes to creativity naman it is common to artists to have that kind of creative rush during deadlines. At tapos yung mga wannabe clients naman ayaw paawat sa gusto at pipigain ka  hanggat di mo sabihin that you are already adding a fee for this on their tab - this is kung hindi naman talaga apt yung gusto nilang design and look sa webby nila, we really do have to argue kasi folio rin naman natin ang nakasalalay sa gawa natin diba.

[franco]

Based on my experiences:

Pinakamatrabaho ang mga "Charity Projects"
Hindi tama ang sobrang "User-Friendly"
Malas ka kapag "Designer Wannabe" ang client mo

Umm.. tsaka before ako magdesign, I make sure na napagusapan muna namin lahat. Actually, meron akong questionnaire na binibigay sa kanila and it helps a lot!  ::)

Man, oh, man.  May bago ako'ng client, Indian.  Jewelry ang business n'ya and acknowledge n'ya na wala s'yang alam.  So, he hired me.  Isip ko gagamitin ko ang virtuemart para sa e-commerce.  Anyway, nag-hire sya ng isa'ng Indian din para input ng products.  Man, nag-conference call kami kahapon dahil may ideas daw ito'ng si data entry clerk.  Needless to say, he tried to lecture me on SEO.  I asked him how long he's been doing web sites.  He said 2 years.  With the client on the phone I went off and toldthe data entry clerk that I had been on the web for 5 years before him and went down the list of clients I have had who I had no doubt he had heard of.  Ang galit ko and told him na he was wasting my time.

Yeap, you're right.  Bwisit pag designer wannabe.

[audienceone]

Man, oh, man.  May bago ako'ng client, Indian. 



Yeap, you're right.  Bwisit pag designer wannabe.

hahaha! I guess lahat ng mga matatagal na sa web has had similar experiences.

[guilliam]

toink!! natural yan.. kung sino ang bopols sya pang maingay. "he who knows less, cries LOUDER!"

[josh007]

Based on my experiences:

Pinakamatrabaho ang mga "Charity Projects"
Hindi tama ang sobrang "User-Friendly"
Malas ka kapag "Designer Wannabe" ang client mo

Umm.. tsaka before ako magdesign, I make sure na napagusapan muna namin lahat. Actually, meron akong questionnaire na binibigay sa kanila and it helps a lot!  ::)

Man, oh, man.  May bago ako'ng client, Indian.  Jewelry ang business n'ya and acknowledge n'ya na wala s'yang alam.  So, he hired me.  Isip ko gagamitin ko ang virtuemart para sa e-commerce.  Anyway, nag-hire sya ng isa'ng Indian din para input ng products.  Man, nag-conference call kami kahapon dahil may ideas daw ito'ng si data entry clerk.  Needless to say, he tried to lecture me on SEO.  I asked him how long he's been doing web sites.  He said 2 years.  With the client on the phone I went off and toldthe data entry clerk that I had been on the web for 5 years before him and went down the list of clients I have had who I had no doubt he had heard of.  Ang galit ko and told him na he was wasting my time.

Yeap, you're right.  Bwisit pag designer wannabe.

hahaha....natawa ako dun sa comment ni franco...muntik ko na maibuka kape ko sa screen....waaaa. these things are part of life, we actually learn from it. always remember that PATIENCE IS VIRTUE. (ano kaya connect nung sinabi ko?...lolz)

[Joomlasticman]

HEHEHE sarap magbasa dito sa forum, dami ako natututunan, buti na lang Libre ang pagbabasa dito. Thank you mga ka JOOMLA!

[Astig]

In my case, time is not a factor. Weird pero totoo sa part ko. Sometimes I can come up with a good design concept in less than an hour lalo na pag trip mo yung theme ng client. In contrast, sometimes, kahit gano na ko katagal nakababad sa harap ng PC, hindi parin ako makabuo ng magandang design. In short, may pagka moody ako sa designing.

As far as client is concerned, normal yung revisions. Madalas kahit wala na sa napag-usapan eh ginagawa ko parin just to comply sa gusto ng client. I don't take those situations negatively instead iisipin ko nalang na meron din naman akong natututunan.

The best thing to do is, set fixed quotes and charge for every revision, consultation or anything that consumes your time. Pero that would be too strict and greedy for some.

[Doomla!]

Gusto ko din ng clients... para makasabay ako sa inyo